Tue, 10 Jul 1995 18:34:00 +0800 RE: Living Galaxy articles on AOL From: JohnAslan@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Greeting all, I have just discovered that in the TSR Online area of America Online Roger Moore has been posting his "Living Galaxy" articles from the Polyhedron magazine. As these were included in the Star Frontiers source list I thought I should let y'all know about it. However, I should point out that TSR has asked that these files NOT be posted elsewhere. Ta, -J
Tue, 11 Jul 1995 12:54:00 +0200 RE: Re: Living Galaxy articles on AOL From: Rache_Bartmoss@digital.fido.de (Rache Bartmoss) To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Hallo frontiers, Du meintest am 10.07.95 um 18:34 zum Thema "Living Galaxy articles on AOL": fue> I have just discovered that in the TSR Online area of America Online fue> Roger Moore has been posting his "Living Galaxy" articles from the fue> Polyhedron magazine. As these were included in the Star Frontiers source fue> list I thought I should let y'all know about it. However, I should point fue> out that TSR has asked that these files NOT be posted elsewhere. Is there a way to grab that article if I'm not an AOL member? SeeYa..! Rache Bartmoss ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Pandemonium - Os/2 Warp - ed and Twisted - Cyberspace - Privatgott Coole Sache, Parker - Gurps - Weltenbau - Lego - Discworld - Netrunner ---------------------------------------------------------------------- #####
Tue, 11 Jul 1995 11:03:23 -0600 RE: Re: Living Galaxy articles on AOL -Reply From: Steve Bartell <STEVEBAR@wordperfect.com> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu >>> Rache Bartmoss wrote:> Is there a way to grab that article if I'm not an AOL member? >>> Unfortunately, this article is an official TSR article that they posted on their site for America On-Line. As a result, the only place this will be located is on America On-Line. These articles, as well as a wealth of other official TSR information (such as Dragon Magazine online) are all located here as well. It is possible, however, to sign up for America On-Line and get your first 10 hours free. You can then download what you want and decide if you want to dump it afterwards. I had signed up on aol a few time to get my free hours and then quit, but since TSR created their site, I have remained on. Anyone who has a modem and is interested, I can input your name on aol and have them send a free disk to you to get you started. Just let me know. -Steve Bartell
Tue, 11 Jul 1995 10:54:43 -0700 (GMT-0700) RE: Re: Living Galaxy articles on AOL -Reply From: Andrew L Chang <changa2@watnxt01.ucr.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu I have a few free hours that AOL sent me. If I use those to try it out, how do I find the TSR section? Andrew L Chang ********************************************************************** The Lord is our God, the Lord alone. Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength. Deuteronomy 6:4-5 **********************************************************************
Tue, 11 Jul 1995 12:12:20 -0600 RE: Re: Living Galaxy articles on AOL -Reply -Reply From: Steve Bartell <STEVEBAR@wordperfect.com> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu >>> Andrew L Chang wrote> 07/11/95 11:54am >>> I have a few free hours that AOL sent me. If I use those to try it out, how do I find the TSR section? Andrew L Chang >>> After starting aol, select the "Go To" menu on top, then select "keyword". Type in the keyword "TSR". This will take you to the TSR section of America Online. The Living Galaxy articles are under the "Download of the Month" section. There are also hundreds of other useful files in the TSR section, including some Star Frontiers articles, etc. -Steve Bartell
Tue, 11 Jul 1995 15:29:10 -0400 RE: Re: Living Galaxy articles on AOL -Reply From: JohnAslan@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu I have a few free hours that AOL sent me. If I use those to try it out, how do I find the TSR section? Select the Keyword function and enter "TSR" -J
Tue, 2 May 95 11:24:24 EST RE: Re: Living Galaxy articles on AOL -Reply From: "Eric Pawtowski" <epawtows@vt.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu In Message Tue, 11 Jul 1995 11:03:23 -0600, Steve Bartell <STEVEBAR@wordperfect.com> writes: >It is possible, however, to sign up for America On-Line and get your first >10 hours free. You can then download what you want and decide if >you want to dump it afterwards. I had signed up on aol a few time to get Just be careful if you use one of those "free" AOL disks. I know a couple of people who used it, paid for by credit card, and then found that they couldn't unsubscribe. Three of them ended up canceling their credit card- it was the only way to stop AOL from billing it each week. The rest decoded to keep the service. Eric epawtows@vt.edu---------------------------------------------------
Wed, 12 Jul 1995 11:53:00 +0200 RE: Re: Living Galaxy articles on AOL -Reply From: Rache_Bartmoss@digital.fido.de (Rache Bartmoss) To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Hallo frontiers, Du meintest am 11.07.95 um 19:03 zum Thema "Re: Living Galaxy articles on AOL -Reply": fue> Unfortunately, this article is an official TSR article that they posted fue> on their site for America On-Line. As a result, the only place this will fue> be located is on America On-Line. These articles, as well as a wealth of fue> other official TSR information (such as Dragon Magazine online) are all fue> located here as well. A pity. fue> It is possible, however, to sign up for America On-Line and get your fue> first 10 hours free. You can then download what you want and decide if fue> you want to dump it afterwards. I had signed up on aol a few time to get fue> my free hours and then quit, but since TSR created their site, I have fue> remained on. Anyone who has a modem and is interested, I can input fue> your name on aol and have them send a free disk to you to get you fue> started. Just let me know. Ah, thanks for the offer, but then I live in Germany. Calling the US of A is DM 0,23 per 7 Seconds. That's $0.15.... Not an option, unfortunately. SeeYa..! Rache Bartmoss ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Pandemonium - Os/2 Warp - ed and Twisted - Cyberspace - Privatgott Coole Sache, Parker - Gurps - Weltenbau - Lego - Discworld - Netrunner ---------------------------------------------------------------------- #####
Wed, 12 Jul 1995 15:27:52 -0400 RE: Re: Living Galaxy articles on AOL -Reply From: MALCOLMJAY@aol.com To: Rache_Bartmoss@digital.fido.de (rachebartmoss), frontiers@uidaho.edu By the way, AOL just got involved w/ a German firm, the name escapes me, and AOL should be available in Germany and/or Europe in the near future. Cheers :) Malcolm
Thu, 13 Jul 1995 02:43:11 -0700 RE: Is this list active? From: acorania@teleport.com (Sean Mahoney) To: frontiers@uidaho.edu I don't think I have heard anything from this list. Is it still active? Is anyone still getting this? If this is recieved, please respond. A Corania Sean Mahoney "tarry not lest ye be swept away" Actually no one said it and it doesn't mean anything!
Thu, 13 Jul 1995 08:01:04 -0400 RE: Re: Is this list active? From: MALCOLMJAY@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Got it, Sean ! Malcolm
Thu, 13 Jul 1995 10:18:17 -0900 (PDT) RE: Re: Is this list active? From: "Frank W. Patnaude, Jr. x2857" <fpatna1@umbc.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu On Thu, 13 Jul 1995, Sean Mahoney wrote: > I don't think I have heard anything from this list. Is it still > active? Is anyone still getting this? If this is recieved, please respond. Sean, Yes. There are other living, breathing and sometimes concious people on this list. It goes thru period of inactivity. I am in the process of creating a Star Frontiers: Sathar War II & III home page from an unfinished campaign that I GMed. I hope to finish it in the next week or two. It will be pretty cool when finished. Frank =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Frank W. Patnaude, Jr. | "Those who do not learn from Applications Programmer | History are destined to repeat it. University of Maryland | And the same goes for Science and Baltimore County Campus | Math." Frank_Patnaude@UMBCADMN.UMBC.EDU | - Woody Boyd, Cheers =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Thu, 13 Jul 1995 09:35:23 -0500 (CDT) RE: Re: Living Galaxy articles on AOL -Reply From: Vox Ludator <ber0566@rs6000.ivcc.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu, rachebartmoss <Rache_Bartmoss@digital.fido.de>, frontiers@uidaho.edu On Wed, 12 Jul 1995 MALCOLMJAY@aol.com wrote: > By the way, AOL just got involved w/ a German firm, the name escapes me, and > AOL > should be available in Germany and/or Europe in the near future. Cheers :) Heh. Would that make it America&Europe Online? :] -------------------------- ----------------------------------------- | /\ /\ /--\ /\ /\ | Vox Ludator == ludator@io.com | | \ \/ / | [] | \ \ / / | == ber0566@rs6000.ivcc.edu | | \__/ \__/ /_/ \_\ | Acting Clerk, The Disposable Heroes | -------------------------------------------------------------------- | Geek Code Ver. 2.0 == GO d(--) H+@ s+:+ g+ p2+@ !au a- w+(+++) v++ | | C+++(++++) UA+ L+ 3 E N+(+++) K--- W M+ !V -po+ Y+ t+@ 5++++ j++ | | R+++ G''''tv b+ !D B---- e u--- h-->- f !r n--- x? | --------------------------------------------------------------------
Thu, 13 Jul 1995 11:26:47 -0400 RE: Re: Is this list active? From: TRichar732@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Hello, I agree, it has been some time since I have recieved anything. I was wondering if the frontiers address was gone or if it was just a lull in the activity. Trichar732 Portland Or.
Thu, 13 Jul 95 13:17:45 EST RE: RE: Is this list active? From: "Eric Pawtowski" <epawtows@vt.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu In Message Thu, 13 Jul 1995 02:43:11 -0700, acorania@teleport.com (Sean Mahoney) writes: > I don't think I have heard anything from this list. Is it still >active? Is anyone still getting this? If this is recieved, please respond. Well, I am. Not much going on in my local SF game that is worth relating, particularly since it's the odd one that's run under Hero system mecahnics. Eric epawtows@vt.edu---------------------------------------------------
Thu, 13 Jul 1995 18:08:52 -0700 RE: Re: Is this list active? From: Mark Damon Hughes <kamikaze@kuoi.asui.uidaho.edu> To: frontiers@crow.csrv.uidaho.edu Frank W. Patnaude, Jr. x2857 <fpatna1@umbc.edu> spake: > Yes. There are other living, breathing and sometimes concious > people on this list. It goes thru period of inactivity. I am in the > process of creating a Star Frontiers: Sathar War II & III home page from > an unfinished campaign that I GMed. I hope to finish it in the next week > or two. It will be pretty cool when finished. Groovy! Throw me an URL when it's presentable. And that goes for everyone: if you have any files or anything, toss 'em my way, and I'll tack them onto the <a href="http://kuoi.asui.uidaho.edu/~kamikaze/frontiers.html">Star Frontiers Home Page</a>. And don't get too upset at the really crude page right now, I plan to make it look snazzy (and more importantly, take it off of my generic graph paper background) before this weekend and submit its address to Yahoo so it can get noticed. <sigh> And my solar system generator is still half-finished - I could make lame excuses like "I've been writing PM code which will could actually make me some money", but what's the use? |+) -Mark Damon Hughes, list-owner
Fri, 14 Jul 1995 01:14:00 +0200 RE: Re: Living Galaxy articles on AOL -Reply From: Rache_Bartmoss@digital.fido.de (Rache Bartmoss) To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Hallo frontiers, Du meintest am 13.07.95 um 16:35 zum Thema "Re: Living Galaxy articles on AOL -Reply": fue> > By the way, AOL just got involved w/ a German firm, the name escapes fue> > me, and AOL fue> > should be available in Germany and/or Europe in the near future. Cheers fue> > :) fue> Heh. Would that make it America&Europe Online? :] Actually, having "Germany On-Line" around scares the heck out of me; you can see what kind of user aol did attract <eg> Just kiddin' folks.. ;-) SeeYa..! Rache Bartmoss ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Pandemonium - Os/2 Warp - ed and Twisted - Cyberspace - Privatgott Coole Sache, Parker - Gurps - Weltenbau - Lego - Discworld - Netrunner ---------------------------------------------------------------------- #####
Mon, 07 Aug 1995 08:28:50 -0600 RE: SF stuff for sale? From: Steve Bartell <STEVEBAR@wordperfect.com> To: wes@deakin.edu.au, frontiers@uidaho.edu I have a friend who is trying to purchase the Star Frontiers and Knighthawks boxed sets from someone on the net. Does anyone have these that you want to sell? If so, you can contact me - stevebar@novell.com, or Wayne at wbrade01@mpg.gmpt.gmeds.com. Thanks! Steve Bartell
Mon, 18 Sep 1995 10:36:20 -0500 (EST) RE: Hello From: Cheese <JDMARQUART@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu O, my first post to this list... hmmm, what will I ask... I know... HOW DO YOU PRONOUNCE: Dralasite? -Cheese (We've has Drah-asss-ill-light, Drah-la-sight, Dral-ma-zy-te, etc...) -- "Ughieeee!" "Jeepers, what is it, Auggie Ben Doggie? Did you feel a great disturbance in the Force? As if millions of voices cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced?" "No, just a little headache." -Fluke Starbucker and Auggie Ben Doggie in _Hardware Wars_ "You'll laugh, you'll cry, you'll kiss three bucks goodbye!" Joshua Marquart (aka Cheese) --- jdmarquart@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu See Cheese's Homepage at http://www.muohio.edu/~jdmarquart
Mon, 18 Sep 1995 10:50:52 -0400 (EDT) RE: Re: Hello From: Mike Baek <baek@panix.com> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu, frontier@uidaho.edu > > HOW DO YOU PRONOUNCE: Dralasite? > > -Cheese (We've has Drah-asss-ill-light, Drah-la-sight, Dral-ma-zy-te, etc...) Seriously? We've always used drah-le-site or just 'marshmellow dude' mike
Mon, 18 Sep 1995 10:02:28 -0500 (CDT) RE: Re: Hello From: Vox Ludator! <ber0566@rs6000.ivcc.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu On Mon, 18 Sep 1995, Cheese wrote: > O, my first post to this list... hmmm, what will I ask... I know... > > > HOW DO YOU PRONOUNCE: Dralasite? I (and everyone I know) pronounces (or pronounced -- it's been a while since I last played the game) it DRAH-luh-syte. Vox Ludator
Mon, 18 Sep 1995 11:25:52 -0900 (PDT) RE: Re: Hello From: "Frank W. Patnaude, Jr. x2857" <fpatna1@umbc.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu On Mon, 18 Sep 1995, Cheese wrote: > O, my first post to this list... hmmm, what will I ask... I know... > > HOW DO YOU PRONOUNCE: Dralasite? I've always pronouced it drah las sight. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Frank W. Patnaude, Jr. | "Those who do not learn from Applications Programmer | History are destined to repeat it. Univ MD Baltimore County | And the same goes for Science and fpatna1@umbc.edu | Math." - Woody Boyd, Cheers
Mon, 18 Sep 1995 15:49:52 -0500 (EST) RE: Re: Hello From: Cheese <JDMARQUART@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu You wrote: > On Mon, 18 Sep 1995, Cheese wrote: > > O, my first post to this list... hmmm, what will I ask... I know... > > > > > > HOW DO YOU PRONOUNCE: Dralasite? > I (and everyone I know) pronounces (or pronounced -- it's been a while > since I last played the game) it DRAH-luh-syte. > Vox Ludator HEY VOX! Whazzup! Anyway, OK, I ALSO had problems with "Yazirian". I also want to know what modules the Ifshnits (sp?), Hummas, and Osakars (Sp?) came in? Along wit the Mechanoids (That it?). Has there been any history since the Zebulon's Guide? Has anyone compiled all the Dragon Magazine entries? Just wondering. -Cheese -- "Ughieeee!" "Jeepers, what is it, Auggie Ben Doggie? Did you feel a great disturbance in the Force? As if millions of voices cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced?" "No, just a little headache." -Fluke Starbucker and Auggie Ben Doggie in _Hardware Wars_ "You'll laugh, you'll cry, you'll kiss three bucks goodbye!" Joshua Marquart (aka Cheese) --- jdmarquart@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu See Cheese's Homepage at http://www.muohio.edu/~jdmarquart
Mon, 18 Sep 1995 12:20:44 -0900 (GMT-0900) RE: Re: Hello From: Andrew L Chang <changa2@watnxt09.ucr.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu I always pronounced Dralsite as DRA-luh-site, but some of my friends pronounce it DRAL-u-site. For Yazirian I use ya-ZI-rian. The Ifshinit, Osakar, Humma, and Mechanon are detailed as PC's in the Zebulon's Guide to Frontier Space. As far as I know the Mechanons are the only race included in a module, the original Volturnus series. Andrew L Chang ********************************************************************** The Lord is our God, the Lord alone. Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength. Deuteronomy 6:4-5 **********************************************************************
Mon, 18 Sep 1995 18:07:16 -0500 RE: Star Frontiers Stuff List From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu this is the current copy of my master list. If anyone has anything that I've missed, PLEASE let me know. If you have stuff on this list that I don't have (in parens) PLEASE talk to me about working out some sort of info trade. If you'd like to maybe workout some sort of trade for info I have, let me know, as well. Alpha Dawn Boxed Set Basic Rules Expanded Rules Map, 2d10, Counters SF0 Crash On Volturnus Module Knight Hawks Boxed Set Tactical Operations Manual Campaign Book Map, 2d10, Counters SFKH0 Warriors of White Light SFAC1 Character Sheets (AD) SFAC2 ?? Referee's Screen + Assault on Starship Omicron Mini-Mod SFAC3 Zebulon's Guide to Frontier Space SF1 Volturnus Planet of Mystery SF2 Starspawn of Volturnus SF3 Sundown on Starmist SF4 Mission to Alcazzar SF5 Bugs In The System SF6 Dark Side of the Moon SFKH1 Dramune Run SFKH2 Mutiny on the Eleanor Moraes SFKH3 Face of the Enemy SFKH4 The War Machine 2001 A Space Odyssey 2010 Odyssey Two _ENDLESS QUEST Books_: These are about a Jr High reading level. #8 Villians of Volturnus #17 Captive Planet #24 Mission on Artule (exceptionally BAD, Earth is in the system, no other UPF character races but 6 anon. Yaz thugs. Not really StarFron) __DRAGON MAGAZINE__ __TITLE__ __SUBJECT__ __SOURCE__ Blastoff! First Look at SF Review Dragon 65 The SF 'Universe' Detailed Review Dragon 74 Zethra, The New Race Dragon 84 StarQuestions Q&A (from Polyhedrons) Dragon 85 Fast and Deadly Starships Dragon 86 Freeze! Star Law! Law Enforcement Dragon 87 Battle of Ebony Eyes Mini-Mod, Black Holes Dragon 88 StarQuestions Q&A Dragon 88 Yachts and Privateers Return Starships Dragon 88 The Mighty Mega-Corporations Mega-Corps, History(in Zeb) Dragon 89 Mega-Corporations o.t. Frontier Mega-Corps, History(in Zeb) Dragon 90 Careers in Star Law Law Enforcement Dragon 91 Day of the Juggernaut Mini-Mod, Huge Ship Dragon 91 StarQuestions Q&A Dragon 92 Rare Wines and Ready Cash Agricultural Trade Dragon 93 From Anarchy to Empire Governments Dragon 94 Zuraqqor Strike Back, The New Race, Mini-Mod, Starships Dragon 95 Coming of the S'sessu, The New Race, Sathar Dragon 96 StarQuestions Q&A Dragon 97 StarQuestions Q&A Dragon 98 Volturnus Connection, The Volturnus Dragon 98 Tanks a Lot! Vehicle Combat Dragon 99 SilverTwin Star Law Enforcement, Vehicle Dragon 102 Saurians, The New Race Dragon 103 Tanks Again! Vehicle Combat Dragon 103 Star Law Returns Law Enforcement Dragon 104 Expanding the Frontier Exploring Dragon 105 Tote That Barge! Interstellar Economics Dragon 107 Old Yazirians Never Die Age and Aging Dragon 108 Patriots, Terrorists, & Spies Cults Dragon 109 Going For a Swim? Underwater Adventures Dragon 110 For a Fistfull of Credits New Items Dragon 112 Interstellar Armory, A New Starship Arms Dragon 115 Here Comes the Cavalry Warfare Dragon 120 Leader of the Pack, The Leadership Dragon 122 Whole-Earth Ecology, The Aliens Dragon 123 Shot in the Arm, A Damage System Dragon 124 Second Look at Zebulon's Guide Zeb Guide Errata Dragon 125 Armored and Dangerous Powered Armor Dragon 129 Frontiers of Design, The Starship Building System Dragon 132 Sage Advice Q&A, AD, Zeb Guide Dragon 135 Damage Control--Report! Starship Combat Dragon 136 ("Jetboots, Dont fail me now!") revised movement rules (Dragon 139) Sage Advice Q&A, DD, ADD, SF Dragon 144 From Freighters to Flying Boats Ships, Boats, Ocean Dragon 149 __POLYHEDRON NEWSZINE (RPGA)__ 9 SF review + dispel confusion 10 dispel confusion (+softcopy) (11) dispel confusion (12)j KH 'feature' review? [12] dispel confusion (softcopy only) (13) Raid on Theseus SFKH + dispel confusion 14 Ambush on Lossend SF + dispel confusion (15) cardstock reference sheet for AD/KH + dispel confusion (16)j dispel confusion [17] dispel confusion (softcopy only) 18 Layover at Lossend SF + dispel confusion (+softcopy) (19) dispel confusion 20 The Proton Beam + dispel confusion 21 Take Command of a Titan! + dispel confusion 22 Of Great Ships and Captians 27 dispel confusion (29)j NOTE: I do not own anything in ()'s scanned softcopy in []'s __Ares Magazine__ (14) ??? (15) Von Neumann machines, Into the Void module 17 Yazirian Cultural Weapon + Miniature Use (Ares Special Edition #2) Frontiers of the Mind(psionics) __Miniatures__ Spacefarers (12) Spacers(?) (12) Robots (6) Federation Ships (6-12)(with miniatures rules conversions) Sathar and Pirate Ships (6-12) (Yachts and Privateers(6)) (Vehicles) (vaporware??: rules for new vehicles like grav tanks) (various blisterpacks of volturnus aliens) as well, the Living Galaxy column in Polyhedron is very good, but not SF specific. roymeo .sigs suck
Wed, 20 Sep 1995 14:30:50 -0600 (MDT) RE: Major race homeworlds? From: Eric Winsor <IGGY@cc.usu.edu> To: FRONTIERS@uidaho.edu I have a matter for debate. In the SF guides it states that the four major races do not know their origins. The Zebulon's guide then gives a time line in which it tells when each world was discovered that appear on the starmaps. All the world are discovered, none are left as origin worlds for the four races. Now I can imagine up the races not knowing what worlds they came from, but I can not aggree that all the worlds are discovered when the time line describes the meetings of the four races in the begining. So, where were the individual races in the beginning when contacts were first being made? Eric Winsor ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- IGGY@CC.USU.EDU http://grumpy.usu.edu/~iggy/index.html -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Wed, 20 Sep 1995 17:35:29 -0500 (EST) RE: Re: Major race homeworlds? From: Cheese <JDMARQUART@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu You wrote: > I have a matter for debate. In the SF guides it states that the four > major races do not know their origins. The Zebulon's guide then gives > a time line in which it tells when each world was discovered that > appear on the starmaps. All the world are discovered, none are left > as origin worlds for the four races. Now I can imagine up the races > not knowing what worlds they came from, but I can not aggree that all > the worlds are discovered when the time line describes the meetings of > the four races in the begining. So, where were the individual races > in the beginning when contacts were first being made? I was under the impression (Also, but I haven't read the books in AGES...) that Earth never existed, or didn't have anythign to do with SF, that's right, right? Makes one wonder if it might be a neat Campaign idea? "Stranded on Earth!!!!! =) " -Cheese -- "Ughieeee!" "Jeepers, what is it, Auggie Ben Doggie? Did you feel a great disturbance in the Force? As if millions of voices cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced?" "No, just a little headache." -Fluke Starbucker and Auggie Ben Doggie in _Hardware Wars_ "You'll laugh, you'll cry, you'll kiss three bucks goodbye!" Joshua Marquart (aka Cheese) --- jdmarquart@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu See Cheese's Homepage at http://www.muohio.edu/~jdmarquart
Wed, 20 Sep 1995 16:43:47 -0500 RE: homeworlds From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Back before this list was actually a list, I asked that same question about homeworlds. The timeline gives the dates when all the planets were found, and I didn't really want to have 'the Frontier' be just a central meeting place between the home systems of the 4 races (the frontier is so large I have yet to flesh most of it out, I don't need the players going to some 'home world/empire' and causing more work for me. so, this is what I once posted: (2) Homeworlds. Where are these people from? I don't buy 'well, we all just sort of forgot where we came from.' Since the timeline gives a list of when all the planets are discovered, (except they forgot Kraatar(Tristkar)) so they can't be (intended to be) from there. Plague planets? That's where I put them...I turned the extra one into the Whorl system, where I am putting the planet Solaris (based on Solaris 7 the battletech game world). but the plague was cured, so I decided I needed to 'get rid of' the homeworlds for good. The Yazirians discovered it's moon was in a deteriorating orbit, and in 23 years it would trash the place. So, they up and transported as much ecosystem as possible to Hentz(Araks) (which later became the home of GodCo the terraforming company). So they at least have some of their natural ecosystem (I decided that Hentz was uninhabited to start out with.) The Dralasite world interacted with the blue plague and IS permanently off limits. The plauge reacted on a genetic/molecular/something level with the ecosystem, and if players land there, they're pretty much stuck, as I'm basing that off of Crystal Singer/Kilashandra books my Anne McCaffrey. The Humans had been fighting for a while before the plague, with a couple tense situations with nukes and the like. They nuked themselves to oblivion fighting over the antidote to the plague. Destroyed the entire planet such that nothing survived, even the moon is too close to the radiation. The vrusk, planet is only a couple light years away from the Ebony Eyes binary black holes (from dragon mag, it's two lightyears over from Epsilon) which made astrogation a hastle to their planet, people kept missing it. Because of the trade problems, the waning resources of the planet, and pure and simple Vrusk Aestetics, they decided to leave the planet, return as much of it to it's pre-Vrusk civilization state as possible, and turn it into a big park that no one ever goes to. It's a 'conceptual park' which they'd probably like. The system will be well defended from pirates and the like who think it'd make a good base (via robotic mini-ships, etc. whatever it is they did during the plague) , but I was also considering there being a Secret Vrusk Lottery, and once a year, a few (50 tops) lucky Vrusk would get to visit it. This is hush-hush, but would be interesting if a PC got selected, just took off with some bugs in a van and wasn't heard from for a couple months. Either the players follow and cause problems, or just let him go and find a much relaxed and focused bug when he returns. ----- critique? roymeo
Wed, 20 Sep 1995 16:45:47 -0500 RE: homeworlds From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu as well, if people are interested, I can post a more complete planet listing for the homeworlds. I also once posted some of the other planets (mostly just the yazirian ones, cause that's about as far as I've made it in my updating of the worlds) and could repost that as well if there are some new people who missed the old stuff. roymeo
Wed, 20 Sep 1995 17:04:04 -0600 RE: Major race homeworlds? -Reply From: Steve Bartell <STEVEBAR@wordperfect.com> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Well, Roy, I must say that I am very impressed with your SF background. I think I will print that one out and put it with my stuff (as I did with all your planet info.) Although I think Roy's idea is a bit more down to earth - here is how things shaped for my campaign a did a long time ago: Anyone who has played the Sundown on Starmist knows of the mysterious race of the K'licks (sorry, I don't have that with me so I don't know if I spelled that right.) Anyway, this was a vrusk type race that was in the frontier ages ago and seemed to disapear. In a long and drawn out campaign adventure, our players discovered that the K'licks actually brought the dralasites, yazirians, and humans to the frontier as slaves in a colonization attempt. The humans were actually taken from Earth long ago (which would be the 20th century in this campaign - kinda goes along with the alien abduction idea), as well as the other races from their prospective planets. In order for the K'licks to use them as slaves, they erased part of the memories of these races so they kept their knowledge intact, but forgot much of their past. This is why they forgot their homeworlds. In an eventual uprising, the races overthrough their slavers and drove the K'licks out. Of the K'licks that remained - they evolved into the Vrusk over the period of thousands of years. Also, this explains the relationship with the Sathar and the Sessu race. In my campaign, the K'licks and the Sathar were at war, and some of the sathar were taken to the Frontier as slaves - these became the Sessu. This also explains why no one knows where the Sathar homeworlds are at. After the K'licks were driven out, the war between them and the Sathar nearly drove them into extinction - thus the K'licks never returned to the frontier to reclaim their colonies. Anyway, it was a much longer and more detailed background, but that is the jist of it. -Steve Bartell
Wed, 20 Sep 1995 23:26:46 -0700 RE: Re: Major race homeworlds? From: acorania@teleport.com (Sean Mahoney) To: frontiers@uidaho.edu >Makes one wonder if it might be a neat Campaign idea? "Stranded on >Earth!!!!! =) " My brother ran me through an adventure like that. My character was the astrogater and I really don't remember to much about it. I guess that would mean that Earth has been lost to the frontier but again ;-). A Corania Sean Mahoney "tarry not lest ye be swept away" Actually no one said it and it doesn't mean anything!
Wed, 20 Sep 1995 23:31:13 -0700 RE: Re: Major race homeworlds? -Reply From: acorania@teleport.com (Sean Mahoney) To: frontiers@uidaho.edu >Well, Roy, I must say that I am very impressed with your SF background. >I think I will print that one out and put it with my stuff (as I did with all your >planet info.) > >Although I think Roy's idea is a bit more down to earth - here is how >things shaped for my campaign a did a long time ago: >Anyone who has played the Sundown on Starmist knows of the >mysterious race of the K'licks (sorry, I don't have that with me so I don't >know if I spelled that right.) Anyway, this was a vrusk type race that >was in the frontier ages ago and seemed to disapear. >In a long and drawn out campaign adventure, our players discovered >that the K'licks actually brought the dralasites, yazirians, and humans to >the frontier as slaves in a colonization attempt. The humans were >actually taken from Earth long ago (which would be the 20th century in >this campaign - kinda goes along with the alien abduction idea), as well >as the other races from their prospective planets. In order for the K'licks >to use them as slaves, they erased part of the memories of these races >so they kept their knowledge intact, but forgot much of their past. This is >why they forgot their homeworlds. In an eventual uprising, the races >overthrough their slavers and drove the K'licks out. >Of the K'licks that remained - they evolved into the Vrusk over the period >of thousands of years. Also, this explains the relationship with the >Sathar and the Sessu race. >In my campaign, the K'licks and the Sathar were at war, and some of the >sathar were taken to the Frontier as slaves - these became the Sessu. >This also explains why no one knows where the Sathar homeworlds are >at. After the K'licks were driven out, the war between them and the >Sathar nearly drove them into extinction - thus the K'licks never returned >to the frontier to reclaim their colonies. >Anyway, it was a much longer and more detailed background, but that is >the jist of it. > >-Steve Bartell > I like what is there and I don't seem to remember any of this. You said that this was just the jist of it, would it be possible to get a more detailed description of what went on (at least as far as you know it). I would enjoy reading it emmensly. A Corania Sean Mahoney "tarry not lest ye be swept away" Actually no one said it and it doesn't mean anything!
Thu, 21 Sep 1995 02:49:56 -0700 RE: Hello there! From: jc21@ix.netcom.com (John Kilgallon ) To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Hi! My name's John Kilgallon, and I'm a 31 year old army officer living in MD. I grew up with Star Frontiers and was thrilled to find this list (this is my first post) What drew me to love the game was not so much the background material, but some of the specific game mechanics. These made the game lots of fun to play. Some of my favorites were 1) The EP system. I liked the referees total control over these, and tying them tightly to achieving party goals and good roleplaying, rather than getting gobs o' points for killing things and getting gold. I also LOVED the dividing of adventures into small "acts" each with it's own sub goals and EP awards. The players liked getting points throughout the evening, rather than just at the end. 2) Parts of the combat system. Initiative kinda sucked (hang around with a really fast guy and you'll get initiative even if the rest of your party are slower than molasses. But the damage system and medic system allowed players to take heroic risks and survive, adding to the space opera feel. The weapons vs. screens thing (rock paper scissors) made planning for battles pretty interesting ("I wonder what the other guy is gonna carry"). 3) The equipment list - simple and complete. Too many sci fi games bury you in gear for in the interest of "reality" 4) The extensive use of combat maps. My group had never used any miniatures or cardboard counters in previous games. Now we never play without them. These are a couple of mine, and I'd be interested in hearing other's opinions. Keep an extra beltpack handy! John K.
Thu, 21 Sep 95 13:54:15 EST RE: Re: Major race homeworlds? -Reply From: "Eric Pawtowski" <epawtows@vt.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Hmmm. The Star Frontiers game that I'm in isn't set in the normal SF universe. For one thing, we've *been* to Earth, it's the homeworld of the humans. And probably the most overdeveloped (and best-defended) system in known space. All the other races have known homeworlds, except the Sathar. The Corvak homeworld (a race made up for the game so one player could have a wookie-like character) is an icy, radioactive wasteland (they nuked themselves back into the Bronze age) but other than that, most are pleasant places. About all we have for an "origin" story is tales of the "precursor" race that not all archeologists take seriously. There are four known precursor artifiacts: the Martian moon Phobos (it is a for-real asteroid, but has a "trailer hitch" made of a material nobody can duplicate), a planetoid on the edge of the frontier named Pumuce (about a hundred klicks accross, made of a strange rock that can only barely be damaged by laser cutters. Pumuce consists of a huge number of air-filled spheres about 300 meters accross with small connecting passages. Very dry air for the most part, with odd lifeforms inside, mostly moderatly evolved versions of misc. animals from other planets in the area, incuding a species of worm from the Dralizite homeworld). The other two artifacts are strange crystal thingies currently in the cargo hold of the PC team's ship. Nobody else knows about those. Found one in the remains of a civilization on the planet Verbenna, and plucked the other from the hulk of a pirate ship that tried to attack Pumuce while we were on it. (Pirates didn't know our ship had a torpedo launcher, which the team Yazirian fired at a range of less than five kilometers :-) I don't suppose anyone has ever figured out what sort of damage a torpedo would do if fired at a ground target? The things don't seem to do enough damage to be thermonuclear. Eric epawtows@vt.edu--------------------------------------------------- Technicon 13- SF&F return to the New River Valley in SW VA! March 22-24, 1996! L.E. Modesitt, Lori&Corey Cole, Ruth Thompson
Thu, 21 Sep 1995 20:06:09 -0500 RE: wanted: adventure ideas From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu It looks like I may actually have convinced some people to play Str Frontiers here, and I'm looking for some ideas for adventures. So, to make this list a little more active, could people post some adventures that they were in in SF, one's that they ran, etc. I'll post some adventures I've been in, as well. This way we can steal some ideas from each other AND reminise about the 'good ole days' at the same time... So, those adventures that really rocked, really were twisted, etc. roymeo
Fri, 22 Sep 1995 13:30:47 +1000 RE: Re: wanted: adventure ideas From: wes@deakin.edu.au To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Hi Guys! > It looks like I may actually have convinced some people to play > Star Frontiers here, and I'm looking for some ideas for adventures. Believe me, it doesn't take much encouragement. > So, to make this list a little more active, could people post some > adventures that they were in in SF, one's that they ran, etc. > I'll post some adventures I've been in, as well. This way we can steal > some ideas from each other AND reminise about the 'good ole days' at the > same time... > > So, those adventures that really rocked, really were twisted, etc. > > roymeo I'm the guy who ran the survey back in April (or whenever), when we were talking about computer-aided campaign design (eg. system generators, character generators, etc). I promised I'd return the results of the survey (like months ago, sure!), so here they are. Unfortunately the results leave a little to be desired. I suppose people are a bit sick of eSurveys. Total responses : 5 ... one of which was less a response to the questionnaire, and more a welcome to the list (most appreciated, too!), and one of which was me. Q1 : Would you like to see Star Frontiers computer utilities? Yes : 4 No : 0 Q2 : If so, what type of utilities would you like to see? Character generator : 2 NPC Generator : 2 Planetary geography generator : 2 Solar system generator : 2 Solar system data base : 2 Galactic Bodies generator : 1 Q3 : What type of computer system do you have? IBM PC : 2 Mac : 2 Q4 : What type of utility would you prefer? DOS '.exe' file : 3 Windows application : 1 Macintosh application : 1 C source code : 1 So there you are! Many thanks to the four of you who participated. The only firm conclusions _I_ got from it was that people want stuff, and that I've become a has-been by sticking with Pascal for so long. On that front, I've overcome my fear of change, and have actually started learning C. Moving right along, I thought I'd share one of my happy SF experiences with y'all. On the particular occasion in question, I was prevailed upon to do a single night's roleplaying game, three weeks from the date I was asked, at a friend's house. "Yeah, sure" says I, "how many players?" "Fourteen," my ex-friend responds. Scenario introduction : A conference room. "A large object has drifted into the outskirts of the Araks system. It is obviously a manufactured structure of some kind, although it has no identifiable markings on its surface. Preliminary visual identification characterises it as some sort of alien space station. "The structure appears to be abandoned. It does not appear to have suffered any major structural damage (ie. that concurrent with a battle), yet it is simply drifting through space. None of the attempts to make contact with the inhabitants have met with success. Sensor sweeps indicate an internal power source is still operational. "You, as members of UPFs Tactical Response Group, have been selected to breach one of the external airlocks and investigate the interior of the structure. You are to report any findings to us at twenty-four-hourly intervals. Further information can be found in your briefing pouches. Thank you, and good luck." The Space Station : The space station was one of the standard 2001-type things - a big outer ring supported by spokes, and a command-centre at the hub. The outer ring consisted of three floors of rooms and gardens, complete with second-floor balconies looking down on first-floor courtyards, etc. The space station was rotating, so there was normal gravity in the ring, and none in the hub. Each of the spokes had a turbolift, which went from the "bottom" (outermost) floor all the way to the "top", in the hub command centre. The Game Begins : I drew a complete map of the station (it was a little thin and lots shorter than what would be expected, although the map was still over 6' long at normal SF scale), and then made reduced photocopies of the whole thing. Each player was supplied with a pre-rolled Alpha Dawn character, a copy of the space station map, and a secret card. The secret card ran along the lines of : As you are aware, your service to Cassidine Development Corporation Information Services has been exemplary in the last few years. This, however, could be your most important assignment yet. You must not let any new technology which may be found on the space station fall into Pan-Galactic's hands. If possible, bring any new technology back to the Cassidine R&D Dept. If this is not possible, destroy it. To aid you in this task, a fellow CDC IS agent has been secreted amongst the investigating crew. You can make contact with the agent using the secret password "Three Large Red Triangles". Good Luck. The game starts with the fourteen characters having just entered the command centre at the hub through the freshly-breached airlock. As well as bunches of lovely computer equipment, there are three doors leading to the three turbolifts. Each turbolift can only hold about eight humans. Schemes Within Schemes : The investigating party, supposedly consisting of 14 loyal UPF members, actually consisted of : Two (2) Cassidine corporate spies Two (2) Pan-Gal corporate spies One (1) Streel Corp corporate spies Two (2) Sathar spies Two (2) Kraatar Liberation Corps spy One (1) Free Frontiersmen Foundation spy Two (2) Government spy from Hentz (Araks) One (1) Government spy from Zik-Kit (Kizk'-Kar) One (1) Spy from "The Company" (organised crime) Everybody was told they had a partner, and everybody had a 'secret password'. All of the passwords were similar, although everybody (including 'partners') had a different variation ("Are you sure you didn't mean TWO small blue circles? Oh, well, it must be right"). To make it harder still, the spies from Hentz, for example, need not have been yazirians. The game was an absolute rippa! Everybody immediately broke into groups no larger than three, and went off on their own through the space station. I kept track of everybody on my big map, but kept that hidden behind on of the couches. No-one knew where anyone else was... until they actually ran into each other. There were sniper shots from balconies, blast grenades down turbolift chutes... all sorts of things. The only two people who were meant to be together were the two Sathar spies, who in the sixth hour of the game successfully blew the space station up. They escaped, but were of course tortured to death by the Sathar during their 'debriefing'. Despite the fact that no-one had played Star Frontiers before (in fact, four of the players had never RPGed before), everyone had a great time. Oh, well! Enough wasted bandwidth for one day. - Wes
Thu, 21 Sep 1995 22:49:09 -0600 (MDT) RE: Homeworlds. From: Eric Winsor <IGGY@cc.usu.edu> To: FRONTIERS@uidaho.edu The ideas about Human, Yazirian, Vrusk, and Dralasite home worlds I got in response are great. I am a bit of a pureist and have always kept my campaign pretty close to the zebulon guide timeline. I am about to start a new campaign and want some sort of homeworlds for the races. I will probably create four new star systems to be home worlds. I am looking for the most logical places for these systems however. I also take the forntier map and make it a series of planes in space (I can not stand 2d space) so the worlds can go above or bellow the planes of the frontier map. Eric Winsor ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- IGGY@CC.USU.EDU http://grumpy.usu.edu/~iggy/index.html -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fri, 22 Sep 1995 09:01:21 -0600 RE: wanted: adventure ideas -Reply From: Steve Bartell <STEVEBAR@mailb.orem.novell.com> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Roy, how about an orbiting cryogenic sleeper spaceship that holds slaves for the Star Devil that they sell and use in an aquatic mining operation! :-) Just kidding, but here is a quick mini-adventure I did once that went over great with my players: When you look at the city map that comes with the Alpha Dawn game, you will notice a zoo in the lower left hand corner. This is only a portion, and has been cut off. One adventure I ran used this map and the zoo, which I expanded upon. It seems that the animals at the zoo were unusually active, eating abnormally, and very aggressive - much to the delight of the zoo patrons. An animal rights group suspected foul play at the zoo and hired the players to investigate. Unable to find anything by casual visits, the character's are instructed by the group to enter the zoo after hours and see what they can find. The zoo is almost totally automated with robot zoo keepers and security bots (in fact, some heavily armed security bots - which in itself sparked suspicion with the players). While trying to dodge infrared and sneak around the zoo, the players eventually broke into one of the supply areas and found the evidence they were looking for. A drug (I forget what I called it) was being used on the animals that increased their metabolism and activity. This drug had been found harmful to animals in the long run and hand been claimed illegal years earlier. So with evidence in hand, the players now try to go back to the group who hired them. Of course (evil grin), they did not make it out of the zoo before being discovered (the storage area was alarmed and they forgot to check it) by the security robots and having it out. Some fun twists on this one (although I did not get to use them) are having the robots release a dangerous animal or two to deal with the players - like a Volturnian Cave Bear, having the security robots incapaticate the players with sonic stunners and the like and then trying to dispose of the evidence by putting the players into one of the carnivorous creatures cages, or having the police come (which did happen in my game - although the players slipped out undetected). But the adventure does not have to be over there. The players then had to find a way to legally expose the zoo without revealing their illegal entry. Anyway, hope that helped! -Steve Bartell
Fri, 22 Sep 1995 14:11:57 -0500 RE: alpha dawn up for sale From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu This is a section of a post I noticed on Rec.games.frp.marketplace. Just reposting it for your benefit. Note: I have no clue who 'Maverick' is, refuse to vouch for said person. BUYER BEWARE (especially if it comes from AOL with all those 10 free hour accounts floating about)(though for such a small purchase, you're not in much risk). From: thmaverick@aol.com (ThMaverick) Organization: America Online, Inc. (1-800-827-6364) Date: 22 Sep 1995 11:36:45 -0400 Subject: NEW!! **MAVERICK'S 10/31 AUCTION** 20% OFF!! MAVERICK'S 10/31 AUCTION! >> BIDDING STARTS 8:00am PST on September 22, 1995!! I am auctioning the following items from my wargame/boardgame/RPG collection. All games are USED unless otherwise noted. Dates given are the rules date. For information about the condition of specific games, please consult my AUCTION CATALOG for detailed descriptions on each game (rule #11 below tells you how to get one.) To the best of my knowledge all games are complete unless otherwise noted. >> REWARD FOR EARLY BIDDERS - make a high bid before 9/25 and get >> 20% OFF the game!!! ($5 bid=$4, $10 bid=$8, $20 bid=$16, etc.) 44 STAR FRONTIERS/ALPHA DAWN (TSR 1983) **PART-PUNCHED** Far future sci-fi adventure versus hostile aliens MIN $10 roymeo .sigs suck
Fri, 22 Sep 1995 15:28:40 -0700 RE: Re: wanted: adventure ideas -Reply From: acorania@teleport.com (Sean Mahoney) To: frontiers@uidaho.edu >Roy, how about an orbiting cryogenic sleeper spaceship that holds >slaves for the Star Devil that they sell and use in an aquatic mining >operation! :-) You know that is not actually that bad an idea. The characters find an old derilict ship floating aimlessly in space. As they commence further investigation they discover that is apparently an ancient Vrusk ship. In the storage hold they discover the bodies of various species (perhaps even some that do not exist in the federation today) in cold sleep. The ship is towed into the nearest major stardock. If the players are working for someone (i.e. the UPF, PanGal, etc.) the ship now belongs to thier employer. If, however, the players are working on thier own they now own the ship. Top archeologist and scientists all have amazing curiousity in the vessel as well as many major orginizations. Bids are given and everone just assumes that the group will sell. When the group searches the computer memory banks they find that the memory storage units have decayed in many parts of the ship (the reason the bodies couldn't be taken out of cold sleep on the ship), However in ther memory they do find star charts that don't seem to coincide with any known charts that are in use today. Unless the characters are truly inventive they will not be able to discover that it reveals the locations of one of the racial homeworlds. The charts are not only from a different perspective but over the course of that many years some of the stars have changed positions or no longer exist. It could be a side adventure to have the characters find a top astrologer who be able to discover this. Throw in alot of intrigue with the companies and it will become a race for (re)discovery. Say that the ships crew was wiped out by a virulent plague that now only effects vrusks and you will get sort of a medical emergency going (of course you would have to throw in a group of human or whatever purist who would like nothing better than to see the end to the vrusk race). If the word got out that it was the vrusks forfathers who originally enslaved all the other major races then those purist groups would gain even more power and members. hmm... looks like this adventure could almost be a campaign in and of itself. Yes I like the ideas I am getting. Politics, discovery, medicine, lost technologies... these are the things that make up a great adventure like this. I will work on it some more and get back to you guys. Tell me what you think. A Corania Sean Mahoney. "tarry not lest ye be swept away" Actually no one said it and it doesn't mean anything!
Fri, 22 Sep 1995 20:24:21 -0500 (EST) RE: Re: wanted: adventure ideas -Reply From: Cheese <JDMARQUART@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu You wrote: > Roy, how about an orbiting cryogenic sleeper spaceship that holds > slaves for the Star Devil that they sell and use in an aquatic mining > operation! :-) it's called "Metamorphosis: Alpha", look into it! =) I'm going to do a Paranoia/Metamorphosis Alpha crossover. -Cheese -- "Ughieeee!" "Jeepers, what is it, Auggie Ben Doggie? Did you feel a great disturbance in the Force? As if millions of voices cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced?" "No, just a little headache." -Fluke Starbucker and Auggie Ben Doggie in _Hardware Wars_ "You'll laugh, you'll cry, you'll kiss three bucks goodbye!" Joshua Marquart (aka Cheese) --- jdmarquart@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu See Cheese's Homepage at http://www.muohio.edu/~jdmarquart
Fri, 22 Sep 1995 18:14:49 -0700 RE: Web page oops From: Mark Damon Hughes <kamikaze@kuoi.asui.uidaho.edu> To: frontiers@crow.csrv.uidaho.edu Urk! I reorganized a lot of my page recently, and I guess I didn't check that the documents on my Frontiers page were still accessable. Anyway, this has been corrected. The URL for the Star Frontiers home page is: <http://kuoi.asui.uidaho.edu/~kamikaze/frontiers.html> I plan to go through the list archive and split up the larger documents as individual files Real Soon Now, and if you have any more stuff, post it... Also, I'd like to get the current art off of that page for obvious reasons, so if anyone with any artistic skills wants to draw up some art, I'd really appreciate it. Oh, and I'd like to see the rest of your background stuff, too, Steve. It's probably the best solution to the whole problem. -Mark Damon Hughes (aka frontiers-owner@uidaho.edu)
Fri, 22 Sep 1995 20:53:16 -0500 RE: the pod From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu > Roy, how about an orbiting cryogenic sleeper spaceship that holds > slaves for the Star Devil that they sell and use in an aquatic mining > operation! :-) You see, he was joking, because this is the adventure that he is running myself and several other people through via e-mail, right now. so, no, it isn't metamophosis alpha, nor is it something about Klikk slaves. It's a tiny little pod pirates kept bodys in storage in. We went there, found out wher they were taking the bodies, and are currently on Volturnus killing pirates in a most bloody fashion roymeo
Sun, 24 Sep 1995 23:33:43 -0500 RE: an idea from matt shelley From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu this was mailed to me, and since I don't really have the time/knowledge I figured I'd pass it on and see what other people thought of this. (with his permission, of course) mshelley@students.uiuc.edu said: Here is my idea, possible or not, perhaps someone can start a SF MUSE/MUSH/MUD/whatever. Just a place that we can link to and talk. I know there is American On-line, but that could get expensive for what I am thinking about. Basically the MUSH would consist of rooms(1-10) that could be used by players and a ref. Maps of adventures could be accessable through a homepage site. I would be willing to use my account, but someone would have to show me how to make a homepage(also a 1 meg limit). Player's could veiw maps on Netscape and listen to the ref, unfold the story. Also outsiders(those not in the game) could enter the room and just become observers(which is also cool to do.) Since you where the one that came up with the SF newsgroup, I thought I would let you think this one over. roymeo
Mon, 25 Sep 1995 04:29:36 -0700 RE: Aaaaaaaaaauugh! Or: Minor problems with the web page From: Mark Damon Hughes <kamikaze@kuoi.asui.uidaho.edu> To: frontiers@crow.csrv.uidaho.edu I've been having a bit of trouble with my frontiers page recently. I don't know why it wasn't accepting what I was doing, but anyway, it's fixed now (well, it works from my other account now, anyway). It always worked fine from this account, so I had no clue. Yeah, so what else is new? <sigh> And I'll be updating the list archive more often... If you want the most up-to-date archive, you should still ask Majordomo, though. -Mark Damon Hughes "Time is nature's way of making sure everything happens at once."
[Note: October seems to have gone walkies - I'm trying to locate it, and I'll get it back online as soon as possible, if possible]
Wed, 1 Nov 1995 00:27:47 -0600 RE: new sf homepage From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu I just recently discovered a new WWW page which WILL have some Star Frontiers stuff in it. As of yet, there isn't anything, but it's something to check in the future. This is the homepage of the guy who uploaded a bunch of campaign info to AOL. http://www.netside.com/~fairhand roymeo http://www.public.iastate.edu/~roymeo (which has a link to his, and has some of the stuff I've been posting here)
Wed, 1 Nov 1995 11:08:30 -0500 (EST) RE: Another New SF Homepage From: "Frank W. Patnaude Jr." <fpatna1@gl.umbc.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu I just put it up yesterday. Check it out: http://umbc.edu/~fpatna1 or http://www.umbc.edu/~fpatna1 Thanks, Frank fpatna1@umbc.edu
Wed, 1 Nov 1995 16:50:59 -0600 RE: Dralasite Homeworld From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu WOTOGON (DELTA) System Notes: It was here that Hatzck Naar's pirate fleet was finally defeated by the First Common Muster. Naar was ejected into space and slowly boiled in his spacesuit as he fell toward Wotogon. Lomigleeb Moons: (1) Daal Gravity: 0.802 Day: 32 hours Year: 500 days (16,000 hours) Diameter: Inclination: 0 Orbit: Atmosphere: Climate Range: Average Surface Temperature: 0C % Water: Trade: None (Special: Mining) General Notes: This is the homeworld of the Dralasites. The Blue Plague mutated once in the system and wiped out most life on the planet. Terrain/Climate: Life: Native Species: Dralasite History: Lomigleeb was quarantined in FY58 during the Blue Plague outbreak. The following year the plague infiltrated much of the ecosystem. A saturated system reacted with the Blue Plague and a change on the genetic level occured. Everyone on the planet died in the upheaval, which changed even the geology of the planet. The world is permanently set off limits as the plague infection, though changed, is infectious to nearly all biological organisms. The new existance of the Plague on the planet is different than that of the Blue Plague and cannot be cured. Government: UPF. based upon Crystal Singer/Kilashandra by Anne McCaffery, this is where some really important crystal is mined. Nearly no one is aware that this system is still in use any more than the other homeworlds. Law: Verboten Population: None (Special: Multi Outpost). Society/Culture: _ Daal: Colony
Wed, 1 Nov 1995 16:57:21 -0600 RE: a couple of questions From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu First, a request. Anyone out there wanna share creatures that they've created for SF? I've a hard enough time filling out my various planet systems, let alone worry about any of the actual creatures that live there... Second, a WWW question. Since I've decided to actually put some of my info on my page (standard plug: http://www.public.iastate.edu/~roymeo) in what form would you most prefer files there to be? I started to put things in HTML, but recently having had to take out all the annoying <P>,<H1>, etc. out of files i found, would it be better to just have downloadable files (ms word .doc files for example) so you can actually get the info on your own computer painlessly? Sure, the html looks 'nice' when you are webbing (if you've got a graphical reader), but I don't see the point in me putting time and effort into putting files online just so someone else can put time and effort into making it useable for themselves. so...input, please.... roymeo
Wed, 1 Nov 1995 17:04:51 -0800 RE: Re: a couple of questions From: Mark Damon Hughes <kamikaze@kuoi.asui.uidaho.edu> To: frontiers@crow.csrv.uidaho.edu roymeo@iastate.edu spake: >in what form would you most prefer files there to be? I started to >put things in HTML, but recently having had to take out all the annoying ><P>,<H1>, etc. out of files i found, No need. Under lynx, you can just hit "p", and it'll print the formatted document to a text file (it'll want to call it .html, but the tags will vanish, and it'll look spiffy). Netscape, Mosaic, and so on have similar abilities to print to disk. Test your documents under Lynx, and if they look good that way then they'll look fine saved as ascii. -Mark Damon Hughes "I hate graphical browsers, and graphical users hate my pages. It works out nice."
Wed, 01 Nov 1995 19:17:58 -0500 RE: a couple of questions -Reply From: sbartell@novell.com (Steve Bartell) To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Roy, I personally like downloadable files, since I usually format and print things I find on the web. A nice web viewer can usually save the html text pretty easy too, though, so it doesn't make a difference on my side. I appreciate you putting your files on a web site for us. Thanks! -Steve
Wed, 1 Nov 95 22:01:52 EST RE: RE: a couple of questions From: "Eric Pawtowski" <epawtows@vt.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu In Message Wed, 1 Nov 1995 16:57:21 -0600, roymeo@iastate.edu writes: > > First, a request. Anyone out there wanna share creatures that >they've created for SF? I've a hard enough time filling out my various >planet systems, let alone worry about any of the actual creatures that >live there... I think I could post descriptions of a few alternate races that are used in a local SF game. Can't give stats, though, since they're built on Hero System rules, not Star Fontiers rules. Therefore, I don't know how much good they would do you. Eric
Wed, 01 Nov 1995 23:22:02 CST RE: Re: a couple of questions <199511020104.RAA02208@kuoi.asui.uidaho.edu> From: "rev. roy crisman" <roymeo@iastate.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu mark huges said: ]roymeo@iastate.edu spake: ]>in what form would you most prefer files there to be? I started to ]>put things in HTML, but recently having had to take out all the annoying ]><P>,<H1>, etc. out of files i found, ] No need. Under lynx, you can just hit "p", and it'll print the ]formatted document to a text file (it'll want to call it .html, but the ]tags will vanish, and it'll look spiffy). Netscape, Mosaic, and so on ]have similar abilities to print to disk. Test your documents under ]Lynx, and if they look good that way then they'll look fine saved as ]ascii. *thwaps self* since I can only use lynx from my room, I use it all the time, and didn't know about the (p) command (or forgot), so thanks for that. I guess maybe my question should be: would people rather have the files html formatted so they can look at them online, or do those that do look at/use them want them want them in something preformatted (.doc files)? I guess I'm leaning towards just putting them online as .docs so i don't have to do a lot of work, the charts will already be formatted (the major pain in the ass to html-ize), i can use the funky characters like the /\ | () | \/ character for satellites and have them show up, and updates can be made by a simple upload. I'd put more of an explanation of what the files contained this way so you'd have an idea of what you're getting. Or, do most of the people wanna see what they're looking at before worrying about downloading? so maybe to rephrase the question (yet again): is there great opposition to having them as .docs (or is there some other preferred file format?) as opposed to browseable files? (heck, if everyone is just looking at them with lynx, who cares if things are bolded and <H3>ed?) roymeo
Wed, 1 Nov 1995 23:51:00 -0700 (MST) RE: WWW debate From: Markus Wilkinson <mark@gas.physics.usu.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu About the raging debate on the .doc files. My only preference is to be able to obtain the files in ASCII format. Is .doc ASCII or is it a MS word thing (I dont use MS word)? Bottom line: Whatever format is workable, but having an ascii available would be best for me. Thanks for taking the time to find out, Mark -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Markus Wilkinson Net: mark@gas.physics.usu.edu Mail: Hughes Space and Communications, EO/E1/D112 2000 E. El Segundo Blvd, El Segundo, CA 90245, USA Phone: 310/416-4647 (work), 310/379-6165 (home) Radio: KC7IHX
Thu, 2 Nov 1995 01:02:10 -0600 RE: .doc From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Yeah that's ms word(pc, not mac). It's generally pretty easy to get most programs to convert it, and it's stored as mostly ascii, just not as clean, but I think it's generally pretty easy to clean it up with a text editor (could be wrong). roymeo
Thu, 2 Nov 1995 10:30:45 -0800 (PST) RE: Re: a couple of questions From: "Frank W. Patnaude, Jr. x2857" <fpatna1@umbc.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu On Wed, 1 Nov 1995 roymeo@iastate.edu wrote: > First, a request. Anyone out there wanna share creatures that > they've created for SF? I've a hard enough time filling out my various > planet systems, let alone worry about any of the actual creatures that > live there... Theres a good book out there called 'Barlow's(?) Guide to Extra-Terestrials' that has a bunch of sci-fi aliens in it. > Second, a WWW question. Since I've decided to actually put > some of my info on my page (standard plug: http://www.public.iastate.edu/~roymeo) > in what form would you most prefer files there to be? I started to > put things in HTML, but recently having had to take out all the annoying > <P>,<H1>, etc. out of files i found, would it be better to just have > downloadable files (ms word .doc files for example) so you can actually > get the info on your own computer painlessly? Sure, the html looks 'nice' > when you are webbing (if you've got a graphical reader), but I don't see > the point in me putting time and effort into putting files online just > so someone else can put time and effort into making it useable for themselves. > so...input, please.... You could always put it up with minimal html stuff (title, header, footer, etc.) and then have the rest just straight text. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Frank W. Patnaude, Jr. | "Those who do not learn from Applications Programmer | History are destined to repeat it. Univ MD Baltimore County | And the same goes for Science and fpatna1@umbc.edu | Math." - Woody Boyd, Cheers
Thu, 02 Nov 1995 9:51:56 PST RE: Re: a couple of questions From: Wes Shull <shul9478@uidaho.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu > I guess I'm leaning towards just putting them online as .docs so i don't > have to do a lot of work, the charts will already be formatted (the > major pain in the ass to html-ize), i can use the funky characters like > the /\ > | > () > | > \/ character for satellites and have them show up, and updates can I wouldn't do that. It'll be fine for PC people, but it won't show up in graphics mode fonts, Macs, Unix boxes, or anything else. IBM's proprietary extensions to ASCII for the PC are just that--proprietary. Not universal. As far as the html/doc goes, I'd say stick with straight ascii--don't bother to html'ize it. It's not like you're putting in hotlinks to other stuff. -- Wes "Yatta!" Shull (Chun Li's the only character I can play) [shul9478@[ee.|cs.|]uidaho.edu|wes@nimbus.som.cwru.edu|\ wxs13@po.cwru.edu] <a href="http://www.cs.uidaho.edu/~shul9478/"> Visit Wes's glorious home page!</a>
Thu, 02 Nov 1995 14:46:34 -0500 (EST) RE: Unsubscribe From: Cheese <JDMARQUART@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu> To: owner-frontiers@uidaho.edu Unsubscribe jdmarquart@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu -Cheese -- "I tried it on my German Shepherd. It worked for both of us and now he's my arch enemy, Dr. German Shepherd. I have to save the world from him every month, which is a real bummer." -The Dogcatcher, Queens, NY (on 'Developing a New Secret Formula' from "How to be a Superhero") Joshua Marquart (aka Cheese) --- jdmarquart@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu See Cheese's Homepage at http://www.muohio.edu/~jdmarquart
Fri, 03 Nov 95 13:21:18 EST RE: Beginninger From: delmar watkins <DWATK00@ukcc.uky.edu> To: Star Frontiers Listserv <frontiers@uidaho.edu> Hi all, This is my first post to this listserv. I have been actively seeking stuff about Star Frontiers on the net for weeks now, only to eventually find this 'serv and a couple of Web pages. I was very excited to see this 'serv and the archives because I have been an avid fan of Star Frontiers since it came out. I thought I was nuts to keep up with every module, article, and scrap of info until I saw that other people shared my interest! So that this letter won't be TOTALLY insipid introduction, I'd like to share what I've been doing lately with Star Frontiers. I found a group of gamers in my area a year or two back and have been playing HERO, AD&D, Star Wars, and Cyberpunk 2020 with them. Recently, a suggested in an offhand way that we paly Star Frontiers. To my surprise, the group: a) had heard of Star Frontiers before b) wanted to play I had, however, a dilemma. No one knew the rules, and I find it hard to truly get into a gaming experience if one is having to struggle with both the rules AND a totally new universe. So, one of the players suggested using Star Wars rules in the Star Frontiers setting. So far, it has worked great!! We have played most of SF0 and SF1 of volturnus, and everyone is having a great time. Star Frontiers has always been a really cool setting, with neat aliens ('monsters') and an awesome tone and feel. It is the most comfortable setting I have, beng the first SF RPG I played in. With the Star Wars rules, Star Frontiers has finally, for me, become extremely playable. I plan on using starships more now because Star Wars rules allow for almost everyone, not just people with level 6s in skills, to work aboard a ship. Anyway, I plan on sending my version of Star Frontiers--Star Wars conversion to the 'serv. I will also send the modules in converted form once I have playtested out the stats. I hope no one has done this before. The archives had Star Hero rules but not Star Wars rules conversions. Well, that's all for to-day. I look forward to any suggestions, comments, or 'hi's from anyone, either from the list or private mail. see ya delmar watkins
Fri, 3 Nov 1995 16:32:46 -0600 (CST) RE: Re: Beginninger From: Thorne Aaron W <awt851s@nic.smsu.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Star Frontiers using Star Wars stats? What a great idea. I doubt that I would go as far as you did, but some of the Star Wars books, especially Galaxy Guide 6 are just great sci-fi material. I am looking forward to this much. - Aaron Thorne
Fri, 3 Nov 1995 18:02:54 -0500 RE: Modules From: David Grimm <dgrimm@utcvm.utc.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu If any one has COMPLETE copies of "The Face of The Enemy" and "The War Machine" I am interested in buying them. Please e-mail me directly, Thank you. _____________________________________________________ David Grimm Computer Systems Specialist University of Tennessee at Chattanooga dgrimm@utcvm.utc.edu "Life is too short to own a slow computer" _____________________________________________________
Sat, 4 Nov 1995 00:24:30 -0600 RE: auction selling something someone requested From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Quincey Koziol koziol@ncsa.uiuc.edu (Star Frontiers) Star Frontiers Boxed Set (no box) (?) [$4, F] Star Frontiers Expanded Game Rules (?) [$2, P] 2001: A Space Odyssey (7815) [$15, VF] 2010: Odyssey Two (7816) [$15, N], [$13, VF] SF1: Volturnus, Planet of Mystery (7801) [$6, F] SF2: Starspawn of Volturnus (7802) [$7, VF] SF3: Sundown on Starmist (7803) [$7, VF] SFAC1: Character Record Sheets (7800) [$5, NM] SFKH1: Dramune Run (7805) [$7, VF] SFKH2: Mutiny on the Eleanor Moraes (1/3 of Beyond the Frontier) (7808) [$8, NM] SFKH3: Face of the Enemy (2/3 of Beyond the Frontier) (7810) [$8, NM] (Star Frontiers) SFKH1: Dramune Run (7805) [$6, F] got this from rec.games.frp.marketplace. I have no association with the seller. roymeo
Tue, 07 Nov 1995 17:21:05 -0700 RE: Polyvoxes From: Steve Bartell <STEVEBAR@wordperfect.com> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu What is everyone's idea of how a polyvox works? I was watching Star Trek: Voyager a while ago (the Amelia Erhart (Sp?) one), and they met a guy from 20th century Japan. When everyone talked, he heard them talking in Japanese, while everyone else heard him talking in English. When asked, the captain explained that their universal translator allowed them to hear each other in their own language. This sounded kinda silly to me. What - did it reshape the sound waves as they affected each person? This makes me wonder about the Star Frontiers polyvox. I have always played this item as it hears something in a different language, and then repeats what was just said in the users own language. For example, when an adventurer would talk to an Ulmor, they Ulmor would talk, then the polyvox would repeat the sentence. When the character then responded to the Ulmor, the polyvox repeated what the character said in the Ulmor's language. Is this how everyone else plays this item, or does someone have a better theory? Thanks! -Steve Bartell http://members.aol.com/stbartell/private/index.htm "The surface world continues blindly along, never knowing the wonders, or dangers, of the UnderDeep." -Darkconch the Sage, Fathoms: Aquatic Adventures
Tue, 07 Nov 1995 16:51:17 PST RE: Re: Polyvoxes From: Wes Shull <shul9478@uidaho.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu > What is everyone's idea of how a polyvox works? I was watching Star Interesting question; never really thought about it. It *could* allow each person to hear it in their own language using a really fast version of today's technology. Assuming some sort of earphone system, you could use active noise cancellation (like some current ear-protecting and music headphones use) to remove the sound of the original speech, and then the translated speech would be played through the earphones as fast as it could be translated. I'm not sure you could do it without the headphones, though--you'd need localized noise cancellation. Hope this purely current analysis doesn't interfere with anyone else's neat future-style tech explanations. -- Wes Shull - Computer Engineering/Visual Communication student shul9478@uidaho.edu - http://www.cs.uidaho.edu/~shul9478/ SMS-NES-SNES-NeoGeo-C64:KOR-UY-MI:Death-Prodigy-JeanMichelJarre FordFestiva:Amiga-Macintosh-BeBox:Prolog-FORTH-C-Pascal-assembly
Wed, 8 Nov 95 00:19:12 EST RE: RE: Polyvoxes From: "Eric Pawtowski" <epawtows@vt.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu In Message Tue, 07 Nov 1995 17:21:05 -0700, Steve Bartell <STEVEBAR@wordperfect.com> writes: >repeats what was just said in the users own language. For example, >when an adventurer would talk to an Ulmor, they Ulmor would talk, then >the polyvox would repeat the sentence. When the character then >responded to the Ulmor, the polyvox repeated what the character said in >the Ulmor's language. Is this how everyone else plays this item, or does >someone have a better theory? Sounds like a good enough description to me. Eric
Wed, 8 Nov 1995 08:30:49 -0600 (CST) RE: Re: Polyvoxes From: Christopher Smith <heartlan@mill2.millcomm.com> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu CC: frontiers@uidaho.edu On Tue, 7 Nov 1995, Steve Bartell wrote: > This makes me wonder about the Star Frontiers polyvox. I have always > played this item as it hears something in a different language, and then > repeats what was just said in the users own language. For example, > when an adventurer would talk to an Ulmor, they Ulmor would talk, then > the polyvox would repeat the sentence. When the character then > responded to the Ulmor, the polyvox repeated what the character said in > the Ulmor's language. Is this how everyone else plays this item, or does > someone have a better theory? > > -Steve Bartell That's the basic process I always used. But I have always felt somewhat uncomfortable with this sort of "panacea" technology in SF; the implication is that this "magic box" will somehow take all the work and uncertainty out of a situation. My solution was to treat the box like a useful, but highly imperfect, tool. Languages which are well-known to the polyvox can be translated at about 75-95% accuracy. With lesser-known languages, I felt free to translate syntax and synonyms VERY loosely, making for some interesting results. Characters learn not to become too polyvox-dependent, in other words. Spoken communication is an incredibly difficult thing to quantify; I think a polyvox is great for narrowing the language gap, but in no way can reliably bridge it. My $.02 worth, of course. Chris ---^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^ Christopher Smith Heartland Information Services, Inc. 404 Foshay Tower, 821 Marquette Avenue Minneapolis, MN 55402-2908 heartlan@mill2.millcomm.com (612) 371-9255 http://www.millcomm/~heartlan/ ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Wed, 8 Nov 1995 09:54:32 -0600 (CST) RE: Re: Polyvoxes From: Thorne Aaron W <awt851s@nic.smsu.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu CC: frontiers@uidaho.edu On Tue, 7 Nov 1995, Steve Bartell wrote: > What is everyone's idea of how a polyvox works? I was watching Star > Trek: Voyager a while ago (the Amelia Erhart (Sp?) one), and they met a > guy from 20th century Japan. When everyone talked, he heard them > talking in Japanese, while everyone else heard him talking in English. > When asked, the captain explained that their universal translator allowed > them to hear each other in their own language. > This sounded kinda silly to me. What - did it reshape the sound waves > as they affected each person? > > This makes me wonder about the Star Frontiers polyvox. I have always > played this item as it hears something in a different language, and then > repeats what was just said in the users own language. For example, > when an adventurer would talk to an Ulmor, they Ulmor would talk, then > the polyvox would repeat the sentence. When the character then > responded to the Ulmor, the polyvox repeated what the character said in > the Ulmor's language. Is this how everyone else plays this item, or does > someone have a better theory? > > Thanks! > -Steve Bartell > http://members.aol.com/stbartell/private/index.htm > > "The surface world continues blindly along, never knowing the wonders, > or dangers, of the UnderDeep." > -Darkconch the Sage, Fathoms: Aquatic Adventures > > That's basically the way that I used it, except you have to remember that when the polyvox is exposed to a new language it takes time for the computer system to get a good grasp of the new language. Also, there can be a slight but noticeable delay between a character speaking and the polyvox translating. It isn't magic, it's just sci-fi. Take it at face value and remember it's limitations. - Aaron Thorne
Wed, 08 Nov 1995 12:30:39 CST RE: Re: Polyvoxes <s09f9775.046@WordPerfect.com> From: "rev. roy crisman" <roymeo@iastate.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu ]What is everyone's idea of how a polyvox works? I was watching Star ]Trek: Voyager a while ago (the Amelia Erhart (Sp?) one), and they met a ]guy from 20th century Japan. When everyone talked, he heard them ]talking in Japanese, while everyone else heard him talking in English. ]When asked, the captain explained that their universal translator ]allowed them to hear each other in their own language. ]This sounded kinda silly to me. What - did it reshape the sound waves ]as they affected each person? It sounds silly to me, too. Why do the Klingon's talk in Klingon on occasion? When Worf calls someone a big icky wart, it should say big icky wart not some cool sounding Klingon word. And I suppose though the Japanese guy was talking japanese and it was being translated his lips moved in english whenever the audience was listening to him speak english. They should just get realistic and admit everyone speaks english cause that's what the target audience understands, and they have artificial gravity/anti-intertia devices which never (cept the one movie) get destroyed cause then they need no special effects (cept for jumping across the bridge when a torpedo hits), and everything is mostly 2-Dimensional (cept the one movie) because their audience wouldn't be able to deal with it as easily. Technobabble excuses don't carry very far. ]This makes me wonder about the Star Frontiers polyvox. I have always ]played this item as it hears something in a different language, and then ]repeats what was just said in the users own language. For example, ]when an adventurer would talk to an Ulmor, they Ulmor would talk, then ]the polyvox would repeat the sentence. When the character then ]responded to the Ulmor, the polyvox repeated what the character said in ]the Ulmor's language. Is this how everyone else plays this item, or ]does someone have a better theory? Yes, that's the way I've always interpreted it. If I'm wearing a polyvox (and have it turned on) and I speak in Human to an Ulmor (and the ulmor language is programmed in which takes many hours, and if I've got it set to speak the ulmor language) I speak and it interprets my throat vibrations and then says the ulmor equivalent. So, if we've got three adventure's with polyvoxes, all on, I could speak in human to the ulmor, then my polyvox speaks the ulmor language, while the other two polyvoxes are translating the human into ulmor (or whatever language the owner wants/needs, such as yazirian), then the other two speak whatever they are set to, then they hear my polyvox's ulmor, so they translate the ulmor they just heard into human (or whatever) and speak it, meanwhile my polyvox just heard the other two polyvox's speaking ulmor, so it translates my own sentence into human and repeats it....etc. Course, polyvox must be the correct style for the race wearing it (or at least programmed by a time period to understand the throat/thorax/whatver vibrations of the user, so I can't take off my p-vox and toss it over to the vrusk to use automatically. So, I'd say I'd probably have two styles of polyvox. One which repeats what it hears from language x to language y and vice versa immediately after the sentence/phrase/talking ends. The second type would translate x to y to x but have an ear piece for those requiring them and would work s.t. the user just whispered the statement and the p-vox would be able to speak at a loud tone as soon as it would almost be as if the user was saying it. Things in the propper language the p-vox heard would be translated to the earpiece asap. Of course as several people have mentioned, language isn't something so simple. Maybe we should remake the p-vox as a CAS sized computer, at least. That way you could plug in language modules when necessary. Especially since I kinda have shown that the 'everyone needs a polyvox on' would lead to an endless conversation between polyvox. *gets an idea* wouldn't that be the perfect distraction? The guards think we're over there, cause they hear our polyvox talking to each other. anyway, of course the Polyvox isn't the perfect panacea, because if it was, no one would care about the Pangal language, which is supposed to be the most commonly used language on the frontier. The Common-tongue of Star Frontiers as I refer to it for new people. and of course i devised a language system for the game, too, since I'm of the 'complexity for reality' as opposed to the 'simplicity for ease of play' line of thinking. roymeo
Wed, 08 Nov 1995 12:54:27 CST RE: Re: Polyvoxes <Pine.3.89.9511080819.A23801-0100000@mill2.MillComm.COM> From: "rev. roy crisman" <roymeo@iastate.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu ] = christopher smith ]That's the basic process I always used. But I have always felt somewhat ]uncomfortable with this sort of "panacea" technology in SF; the ]implication is that this "magic box" will somehow take all the work and ]uncertainty out of a situation. ]My solution was to treat the box like a useful, but highly imperfect, ]tool. Languages which are well-known to the polyvox can be translated ]at about 75-95% accuracy. With lesser-known languages, I felt free to ]translate syntax and synonyms VERY loosely, making for some interesting ]results. Characters learn not to become too polyvox-dependent, in other ]words. Ah...combining this with my last post I see that I should probably have the polyvox learn on my language system just like characters do. Level Cost Comprehension Notes 1 7 33% Basic comprehension and vocabulary. 2 5 66% Better understanding; increased vocabulary. 3 4 80% Understanding of structure. 4 3 90% Uses language correctly, accent still detectable. 5 3 100% Native speaker. 6 4 Studied the language. 7 5 Eloquent. 8 7 Verbal and/or literary genius. Of course the polyvox would stop at level 4 and 90% comprehension. And a high quality p-vox might push the numbers up a little, low quality down quite a lot. Now that I look at that chart that I already was going to reconsider changing the experience point costs on (to lower numbers, AT LEAST in the beginning/middle area), and maybe those %'s too. I think that as little importance that language plays in my game, the 7 point 1st level thing is way too high. Players wouldn't waste 7 experience points just to learn the heliope language to move the adventure along, further. any suggestions from people out there (who know more languages than english and latin?) More on P-Vox: Remember, some languages have non verbal components. The dralasites (and steve's example of the ulmor) use non-verbals as well. Sure, if a dralasite is going to talk via radio only, they can get a message across verbally, but instances where a polyvox is being used may not always be one where a dralasite will be paying attention to getting across everything verbally. Wouldn't it be 'funny' to have a dralasite seemingly praising a diplomat using a polyvox all the while the dralasite is excreting a smell of negation. Thus the polyvox would say 'I trust you' whereas the dralasite was really saying "I trust you--NOT!" I wonder how well the polyvox would work on the Osakar language, as well... repeating: ]at about 75-95% accuracy. With lesser-known languages, I felt free to ]translate syntax and synonyms VERY loosely, making for some interesting ]results. Characters learn not to become too polyvox-dependent, in other ]words. This reminds me of the fish-type creatures from Star Control II (computer game). They had rigged up a translator for us, somewhat. "Happy to smell you. That bubbles." Sometimes you couldn't even really figure out what some of the sentences were supposed to mean. {{the game also had a pretty good plot between the two types of Ur-Quan which I may yet steal for use among the Sathar...fits pretty good with what information is revealed in the beyond the frontier modules}} roymeo
Thu, 9 Nov 1995 16:10:26 -0500 RE: Travel through the Void. From: TimC27@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu I don't know about anyone else, but I have always found the description of the Void and travel through it utterly inadequate. The most ludicrous thing is that you simply accelerate to 1% light speed and you 'disappear'. If that was the case, practically all matter would eventually slip into the void. I have written a lengthy article detailing what I call the 'Transit Field', an energy field that surrounds starships as they achieve the 12mkph velocity. I will post it on this board, along with various other Void-related subjects in the article. I would also be interested in opinions on the 'Void'. BTW, I have never played SF as a player, but mastered a couple of campaigns. I loved it as a GM. Especially loved the kind of low-tech approach, one that uses atomic motors and had no Anti-grav. This left plenty of room for precursor race technology to infuse in the campaign.
Thu, 09 Nov 1995 19:22:54 CDT RE: RE: Polyvoxes From: NATHAN FUTRELL <futrena@WKUVX1.WKU.EDU> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu To Steve Bartell: We always did Polyvoxes the same way that you describe, although we usually didn't emphasize it too much, unless it was part of the plot (ie - characters must roleplay learning to talk to the new aliens). John Hans -- --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Nathan Futrell | "That which does not kill us must have missed us." The Madd Katt | ---Friedrich Nietzsche futrena@WKUVX1.BITNET | | "Is it me, or does Rush Limbaugh look like Jabba | the Hut?" ---The Madd Katt (Bo shuda.) ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thu, 9 Nov 1995 18:14:40 -0800 (GMT-0800) RE: Re: Polyvoxes From: Andrew L Chang <changa2@watnxt09.ucr.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu About the languages experience table I have a little to say. I believe that studying languages starts off relatively easy (maybe four or five points for level on), and gets a little easier at the basic levels which involves mostly practice (about 4 points for level two and five for level three and four). However to "lose the accent" and become a indistinguishable from a native I'd say that's when it gets expensive, like six points for level five. After that, I would keep the same values for levels six, seven, and eight. All of these claims come from personal experience (I speak/study English (of course), Taiwanese, Spanish, Greek, Japanese, and Chinese). I hope this is useful 8-) If you have any questions or would like more detail, feel free to e-mail. Servant of God, Andrew L Chang ********************************************************************** The Lord is our God, the Lord alone. Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength. Deuteronomy 6:4-5 ********************************************************************** On Wed, 8 Nov 1995, rev. roy crisman wrote: > Level Cost Comprehension Notes > 1 7 33% Basic comprehension and vocabulary. > 2 5 66% Better understanding; increased vocabulary. > 3 4 80% Understanding of structure. > 4 3 90% Uses language correctly, accent still detectable. > 5 3 100% Native speaker. > 6 4 Studied the language. > 7 5 Eloquent. > 8 7 Verbal and/or literary genius. > > Now that I look at that chart that I already was going to reconsider > changing the experience point costs on (to lower numbers, AT LEAST in > the beginning/middle area), and maybe those %'s too. I think that as > little importance that language plays in my game, the 7 point 1st level > thing is way too high. Players wouldn't waste 7 experience points just > to learn the heliope language to move the adventure along, further. any > suggestions from people out there (who know more languages than english > and latin?) >
Mon, 13 Nov 1995 04:37:16 CST RE: Re: Travel through the Void. <951109160947_102394103@mail04.mail.aol.com> From: "rev. roy crisman" <roymeo@iastate.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu I never actually read it as literal that a ship reached the speed and then magically entered the void. I always assumed that there was some sort of 'void module' with a preset computer controlled timer that turned the module off when it was the propper time, as life forms can't really distinguish time very well in the void. Actually, much of this was just what the three groups I was involved in must have sort of decided, as now that I look at the manual, it does seem to indicate the literal speed = 12,000 => void, which is incredibly lame. Hence it seems that at least two of the seperate groups I've been involved in seperately arrived at the same conclusion: there is something which is then required to push the ship into the void. I was planning on basing a major part of that 'something' as a crystal which can be found on the Blue Plague devastated homeworld of the Dralasites (ripping off Crystal Singer/Kilashadra by Anne McCaffery). Where they got it before then....*shrug* roymeo
Mon, 13 Nov 1995 08:23:58 -0500 RE: Re: Travel through the Void. From: TimC27@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu I would be glad to post you and the list members my essay on the Void. It details what I have called a Transit Field (the phenomenon), Jump Circuit (the impelling device) and some additional hazards of travel through hyperspace, including a list of side effects I called Void Transit Syndrome. I hope it will also become available on TSR Online on America Online. Is there a way to post such an article or send a file? TimC27@aol.com
Sat, 11 Nov 95 22:13:45 EST RE: RE: Travel through the Void. From: "Eric Pawtowski" <epawtows@vt.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu In Message Thu, 9 Nov 1995 16:10:26 -0500, TimC27@AOL.COM writes: >I don't know about anyone else, but I have always found the description of >the Void and travel through it utterly inadequate. The most ludicrous thing >is that you simply accelerate to 1% light speed and you 'disappear'. If that >was the case, practically all matter would eventually slip into the void. I Well, we basicaly treat it as if ships are equpped with Babylon 5- style Jump Engines. No reason to bother with jump gates, since, unlike the B5 universe, most ships are large enough to have jump engines. Eric
Mon, 13 Nov 95 22:17:56 EST RE: Undeliverable Mail (fwd) From: delmar watkins <DWATK00@ukcc.uky.edu> To: SF list <frontiers@uidaho.edu> I should have sent this last week, but I screwed up on the mailing. Here Goes: OK, the next million or so posts of mine will be dealing with the conversion of Star Frontiers to Star Wars rules. I am currently playtesting this conversion with the group of gamers I play with, so some of the stats may change. If you feel qualified to criticize (ie. critique), question, suggest, or just plain talk about these conversions, please send it to the list or me. Hopefully I can get not only the weapons, etc. from SF, but also the conversions for the modules. I always hated having to convert modules, so I will do this public service for this 'serv. OK, first is character creation. These stats reflect the way I think about the different races of the frontier. To me, Vrusk are great business people, Dralasites are good technicians and integrate (but do not necessarily create) information, Yazirians are intelligent and fierce but weak, and humans are just jacks of all trades. In character creation, all races start with their base ability scores and get 6d to distribute, with no more than 2d to go to any one attribute. GM should encourage (possibly with definite rewards) playing templates from the SW rules and trying not to boost too many stats to 4d+. However, SF characters should be well rounded, anyway, so if a power gamer is in the group, make sure weaknesses are ex- ploited. BASE CHART Vrusk Dralasite Yazirian Human DEX 2d+1 1d+1 2d+1 2d KNOW 2d 2d+1 2d+1 2d MECH 2d 2d 2d 2d PER 2d+1 1d+2 2d 2d STR 1d+2 2d+1 1d+1 2d TECH 1d+2 2d+1 2d 2d NOTE: the 6d can be divided into pips for purposes of distribution. All aliens (humans are aliens, too!) get special abilites: Vrusk: ambidexterity (can do two actions using 2 hands/arms in a rnd with no penalty. After first two, -1d penalty as usual); +2d to bargain and KNOW:business; 7d in skills to distribute; +2 to strength for damage soak purposes only (natural chitin acts as armor) Dralasites: DEX+3 limbs (for every extra arm made above 2, +1d to any skill that would be affected by multiple arms, such as brawling, brawling parry, etc. Referee's discretion); Lie detection skill starts at PER +2d and can be added to later; scent tracking: +2d to recognize and track if using scent; 7d of skills to distribute, 2d of which MUST go into knowledge or technical skills Yazirian: Glide (as in SF book); battle rage (+1d to STR, melee skill. Note that the strength addition DOES count for a bonus to skills, damage, and soak); -1d in bright condittion if not protected; does not suffer penalties in twilight conditions (still effected by darkness); 7d to distribute in skills Humans: 10d to distribute for skills NOTE: for dralasite (forgot to add this) at least two limbs must be legs, otherwise they cannot move and opponents can easily dodge away from them. However, some jobs, such as fixing something, may allow for no legs to be used. As an option, arms/legs do not add to the skill, except in terms of how FAST a procedure can be done. Extra dice are only used for speed of fixing something, not if it can be fixed. Also, while the SW and SF skills almost match one-to-one, a few minor adjustments must be made: DEX: Blaster skill turns into Beam weapons; Projectile Weapons (which includes gyrojets, autorifles, needlers, etc.) added; Grenade turns into Thrown weapons, which includes spears, grenades, knives, etc. KNOW: All science skills fit under here, and there are a lot of them. Just use your imagination MECH: Repulsorlift OP turns into two skills: Ground Vehicles and Air Vehicles PER: Two specialty skills: Detect lie, used by dralasites, and battle rage (starts at base PER, cannot be improved in character creation, and yazirian needs 12+ to go into rage, only one try per combat) STR: no changes! TECH: Droid Prog./Rep. is, of course, Robot Prog./Rep.; Equipment Repair (for all scanners, weapons, defenses, and small technological items) added; Repulsorlift Repair turns into Vehicle Repair (both ground and air) That's all for intitial character creation. I may, of course, have errata when I test them further, and I will probably have updates that add the Mechanons, Eorna, Kurabunda (etc.), Mehmne, and other races that TSR decided to skip over in the Zebulon's guide. Oh, and I will not be converting Zeb's guide races over yet. After all these years, I'm still not sure that I like them much... Anyhow, that's it for now, SFers! me, delmar P.S. BTW: In my current campaign, I am using +2d to STR and melee skill for battle rage. It isn't working well, so I toned it down here to +1d. Try it out and see if I'm right!
Tue, 14 Nov 1995 14:09:55 -0500 RE: Re: Travel through the Void. From: JohnAslan@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu CC: DarkStarMA@aol.com On Thu, 9 Nov 1995, TimC27@aol.com wrote: >I don't know about anyone else, but I have always found the description of >the Void and travel through it utterly inadequate. The most ludicrous thing >is that you simply accelerate to 1% light speed and you 'disappear'. If that >was the case, practically all matter would eventually slip into the void. I >have written a lengthy article detailing what I call the 'Transit Field', an >energy field that surrounds starships as they achieve the 12mkph velocity. I >will post it on this board, along with various other Void-related subjects in >the article. I would also be interested in opinions on the 'Void'. In my campaign background, the Void and its effects on interstellar travel, were predicted by the noted Yazirian astrophysicist and mathematician Ma'benga of the Gum'bala clan, based on his studies of the discrepancies between physics and particle physics. This doesn't explain the void or its effects, but I felt that this at least validated the concept. Frontier sciences don't seem awefully advanced beyond our own (its that low-tech style you like so much). Let's face it, these people lucked out - without the Void they would still be stuck in their native star systems. Most of their technologies are only a few decades ahead of us. So I don't think they understand the Void, or that great unknown between quantum mechanics and macro-physics any better than we do. But its there and they do understand how to use it; the cavemen didn't know the the reasons or the 'how' of fire, but that didn't stop them from staying warm and cooking their food. As to my opinions concerning the Void and its nature, hmmm... The Void doesn't appear to be a hyper-space, as no special equipment is required to rip open the dimensional barriers between the different spaces. Nor does the Void seem to be a 'warp' drive, because, again, no special equipment is needed. Those science fiction classics are artificial means of breaking the light barrier. The Void is a natural occurance. So, perhaps the Void is just the Four races' way of explaining jump (or warp or transit or tranfer) points. For the unfamiliar, a jump-point is the end point of a highly stressed (or stretched) section of normal space-time. Hit, or enter, that point in space at the right vector (speed and angle) and ZOOM, your at the other end. Problem is that current theory holds that these points creates a circulatory or nerivous-like system, linking one star system to another through so-many others. Also, not all star systems have jump-points, and so some worlds would remain unreachable. My understanding of Void travel is that if you don't want to go to Prenglar from Pan-Gal via Timeon, you can risk it and plot a new, direct course through the Void. You can do this from any star to any other star. Perhaps the sub-atomic effect known as 'tunneling' offers the best possibility for explaining the Void. Again, for those not familiar with the term; tunneling describes how an electron can change energy-shells (electron orbits) without having to travel through the physical space between the shells or having the energy to accomplish that move. The electron just sort-of 'jumps' from one shell to the other. We don't understand how or why this happens, but maybe those living in the frontier do. An electron is a tiny thing, it could be that a sizeable chunk of matter, say a spaceship, requires the incredible speed (energy) of 1% SOL before the 'tunneling' phenomena can occur. Then its simply a matter of where and how precisely (THAT's what all the plotting time is required to determine!) you are pointing, and how long you 'tunnel'. Actually, the 'tunneling' effect was used in the 2300 A.D. game as the basis for their stutterwarp FTL drive. I also experimented with a drive 'field', though it was a Void 'threshold field'; in other words it recreated the effects of reaching the speed needed to enter the Void. In theory you could activate the field and jump from orbit around one world to orbit around another. Of course, it was top secret and the PCs never really came all that close to it, but it was out there. I disagree with your statement about all matter eventually vanishing into the void; its my understanding that for natural phenomena speeds that great (yes, even 1% lightspeed is REALLY moving) are the very rare exceptions, not the rule. Interestingly enough, any matter that DID enter the Void would be lost forever as it has no way to slow itself to re-enter normal Einsteinian space-time. To conclude I'd like to say that I am VERY interested in your article Tim, and look forward to reading your post soon. Exchanging ideas can only help us to understand these concepts, even if only on an individual basis. Clearly the Void and interstellar travel are crucial to the Star Frontiers game, and should be discussed. I encourage others to respond with their own thoughts, who knows, maybe YOU are the person who can make it make sense.
Wed, 15 Nov 1995 08:42:00 -0500 RE: Re: Travel through the Void. From: TimC27@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Starting to get a few folks responding to how they have handled Void travel in Star Frontiers. Finally, if you are on America Online, you can find the article I wrote on the subject. Its called 'Star Frontiers' (original, huh?) and is posted on TSR's library files. For some reason, its under 'stories', not other 'TSR games'. JohnAslan@aol.com wrote saying "I disagree with your statement about all matter eventually vanishing into the void; its my understanding that for natural phenomena speeds that great (yes, even 1% lightspeed is REALLY moving) are the very rare exceptions, not the rule. Interestingly enough, any matter that DID enter the Void would be lost forever as it has no way to slow itself to re-enter normal Einsteinian space-time.". In response, I would have to point out that even if we disallow the moments surrounding the Big Bang, very nearly all matter approaches 1% light, especially that being spewed by nova and supernova. The acceleration is probably far in excess of that in order for the transmutation of elements to occur. Further, although I am no astrophysicist (I hope I spelled that right), relativity equates acceleration to gravity, and therefore blackholes, pulsars, white and brown dwarves and neutron stars all would slip out of real space. Someone step in and point out my error if so,... I am on thin ice here, relatively speaking.
Wed, 15 Nov 1995 07:52:43 CST RE: Re: Travel through the Void. <951115084159_84778468@emout06.mail.aol.com> From: "rev. roy crisman" <roymeo@iastate.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu I agree with the statement about all matter eventually sliping out... wouldn't all the light itself enter the void, never to return? and we know that E=MC^2, so the light energy would leave the universe... course pretty much no one took the book statement to mean what it apparently says that it's just a speed thing... Seems that the way they rigged it up is much like that in Traveller. You can go from anywhere to anywhere, once you reach a certain speed which allows you to flip some doohickey and go void. When someone misjumps the GM is to pick another star within the range for the ship to go to...this would seem to imply (as in Traveller) that stars (or any large enough body) have a gravetational field which help 'suck in' the ships (misjump or good jump). One would have to wonder how the frontier races discovered that going a certain speed and enacting some sort of resonation/field/technobabble device would allow FTL travel. Notice, the Vrusk were the ones who told the other Frontier races about it. This would fit very well with Steve Bartell's Vrusk-as-decendents-of-Clikk theory. This isn't too much of a stretch from what information is given in the Sundown on Starmist module. Sure, I suppose they could have come up with it theoretically, but that's not as fun as Vrusk-Clikk decendents/finding a Tetrarch artifact sort of thing... roymeo
Wed, 15 Nov 1995 08:33:50 -0700 RE: Another Star Frontiers page From: Steve Bartell <STEVEBAR@wordperfect.com> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu For anyone who is bored on the Web, you can check out my home page address, listed below. I run a Star Frontiers play by email game, and I have put the maps and a few other items for my players there. However, the maps may be useful to anyone interested in SF. There is also quite a bit of AD&D items there. thanks, -Steve Bartell http://members.aol.com/stbartell/private/index.htm
Wed, 15 Nov 95 18:11:08 EST RE: SFtoSF:part II From: delmar watkins <DWATK00@ukcc.uky.edu> To: frontiers <frontiers@uidaho.edu> OK, now that you have characters created you will want to, oh I don't know, EQUIP them. Here's the weapon chart: Weapon dam(in d) Range(s/m/l/X) Ammo Notes Electrost 5 or S 10/15 2 7d stun LasPist 1-4(5) 20/50/100/200 1-4(10) 1d/SEU: 5doverload=10SEU LasRif 1-5(6) 40/100/200/400 1-5(12) 1d/SEU: 6doverload=12SEU SonDisru 7-4 10/20/40 4 damage<at range:7 @PB,6@S, etc. Sonic Stun 6d STUN 10/20/30/50 2 HeavyLas 1-8 100/500/1km/2km 2SEU/d no PB range SonicDev 9-6 25/50/100 10 damage<at range, no PB AutoPis 3,4 15/30/60/150 1,3 3rnd burst does 4d dam. AutoRif 3,4,5 40/100/150/300 1,3,5 3rnd, 10 rnd burst for >dam. NeedlerPis 4, 2d+dr 10/20/40/100 1 barbed=4d,drugs=2d+drugs NeedleRifl 4+1,2+dr 20/40/75/150 1 barbed=4d+1,drugs=2d+dr MachineGun 7d 70/200/500/1km 1 no PB Recoillous 7d+2 150/1km/2km/3km 1 no PB, MUST careful aim GyroPis 5d 5/50/100/150 1 no PB GyroRifl 5d+2 5/75/150/300 1 no PB GrenRifl as Gren 25/50/100/200 1 no PB RocketLnch 9d 70/200/500/1000 1 no PB Grenades damage Defense Notes Doze 6d v.STR 5d Dodge smoke lasts 2 rnds Frag 5d 4d Dodge as normal grenade rules Incend 2d+2/rnd 5d Dodge burns for 1d6+3 rnds Poison as dr.or3d 4d Dodge lasts 1d6+5 rnds Smoke Soft Cover IR Tanglers 5d v. STR 6d Dodge Entangles, 1 STR ONLY check to escape Laser Weapons: They can vary their settings from 1-x d. They use x SEU per d used (1 for Pis,Rifles, 2 for Heavies). Pistols & Rifles can overload for 1 ex tra d of damage (damage in perentheses), but this doubles SEU cost and is not g reat on the weapon. Gyrojets, etc: No PB weapons cannot fire at object within PB range, which is 3 meters. ranges listed above start at Short range. Grenades: As per SW rules, first you se where the grenade hits, then the grenade tries to hit (with its dice in DEFENSE) the character. All grenades have a balst radius of 3m. Note that some grenades have attacks versus limited denfese, no one's total soak, and that some grenades automatically hit each rnd to do damage (fire, poison, tanglers, for exacmple). Entangled characters cannot move or do anything but speak. Melee Weapons Dam(in xd+) Difficulty Notes Club S+(+1-1d) 5-15 difficulty/damage depends on club Spear S+1d+1 10 throw Chain/Whip S+1 15 STR v. STR Entangle Electric SW S+1d+2 10 can also stun for S+2d Knife S+1 5 throw Shock Gloves S+1d+1 10 Sonic Knife S+2d 5 Sonic Sword S+2d+2 5 Spray Hypo as drug 20 Stunstick S+1d+Stun 10 does damage, +1d for stun purposes Sword S+1d+1 10 Vibroknife S+1d 10 VibroSword S+1d+2 10 VibroAxe S+2d 15 Stunsticks do normal damage, but add one 'special' die: if this die brings the damage above incapacitated, then the character is stunned. BTW: The translation to SW makes Sonic weapons really deadly. You may want to limit them in your campaign, either by making them rare or lowering their power. OTHER STUFF: Medical Kits: First Aid kits take 10 seconds/d used for first aid. If successful, heals the character one level. Drugs give +1d for the area they are in. Stimdose allows the character to be 1 wound level less for 3 hrs, or revives character. This may make healing easier. medkits (fully equipped) give a +1d to medical rolls, and surgical areas give +2d to medical roll Techkits and other kits allow for the skills to be used. Lack of them give a penalty, sophisticated equipment gives a +1d DEFENSES: IN GENERAL, screens will give an extra +1d to the damage soak of an individual, but this takes 1SEU/d of damge. Thus, an albedo screen that is hit with a 4d laser bolt will give +1 to the wearer, but will drain 4 SEU of power. SUITS do the same, but are ablative: they have so many points, and give a +1d to the defense that attack form, but each d of damage drains off one point from the suit (albedo suits have 100, skeinsuits have 50, as in the book). A NOTE ABOUT ENERGY: These rules are designed for simplicity of use, and may be changed. So far they are working in my campaign, but if you find that people are abandoning lasers for other weapons WHOLESALE (i.e. you hear comments like 'it takes too much energy to use a laser') then lower the SEU use to 1SEU/2d for both suits and screens MAKE SURE THAT YOU USE THESE RULES FOR REALISM: Wounded characters fall down; prone characters are -1d or must tkae an action to get up. Dodges and parries are for that phase only. If your players are having an easy time of it, send them agianst well-orgainized people that save actions so that characters' dodges get progreessively lower.... Reread the grenade rules. They can get real messy in the right situations, weak in others. OK, this is all that's needed to run a combat (run it the same as in SW, but use these weapons), and equip the character. Next time: vehicles and aliens/robots!
Wed, 15 Nov 95 19:07:02 EST RE: Space Travel From: delmar watkins <DWATK00@ukcc.uky.edu> To: frontiers <frontiers@uidaho.edu> Just to put in my 2cents, I always thought that space travel was a field orsomething that could be (not was) generated at extreme velocities. Basically, it meant one could fold space for limited size objectes and then move them. As for the physics, it would be simply converting particles to tachyon, and then moving those particles a distance, and then reconverting them to normal matter. It took longer to go farther because a greater speed must be reached. I also played that the experience was hallucinogenic in nature (converting to a strange particle is not the most 'normal' of experiences) and that spacers had a pseudo-religion because of this. This, I think, reflects the way sailors were in the old days: the sea was a chaotic god that one didn't want to piss off. Whole philosophies came from the experience of the sea (Moby Dick is an example). In general, I think space is the same phenomena as the ocean, and I have treated it as such. It makes for interesting ideologies, and of course it means that Pirates can say, 'Arr me maties, prepare to be boarded!' in good, dramatic fashion. (Corny, but hey, what the heck) me, delmar watkins Date: Wed, 15 Nov 95 18:11:08 EST From: delmar watkins <DWATK00@ukcc.uky.edu> Subject: SFtoSF:part II To: frontiers <frontiers@uidaho.edu> ======================================================================== OK, now that you have characters created you will want to, oh I don't know, EQUIP them. Here's the weapon chart:
Wed, 15 Nov 1995 20:06:46 -0600 RE: more on the void From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Delmar Watkins said: ----- It took longer to go farther because a greater speed must be reached. I also played that the experience was hallucinogenic in nature (converting to a strange particle is not the most 'normal' of experiences) and that spacers had a pseudo-religion because of this. This, I think, reflects the way sailors were in the old days: the sea was a chaotic god that one didn't want to piss off. Whole philosophies came from the experience of the sea (Moby Dick is an example). ----- (seems all the things I've said in discussions before are coming back to me!) The first quoted line is very important for us SF fans. In one book we're told about needing to reach .01c. Yet we know from the boardgame that the number of light years between stars is the number of days travel needed. Yet the travel in the void is supposed to be only a fraction of a minute. So in my jury-rigged theory about the Void, apparently for a sucessful jump you must be going faster to go farther. Thus the .01c must be some sort of lower bound, not the absolute needed to go anywhere. More and more, the .01c comment seems to be something someone wrote to give a touch of flavor, not a statement that we are supposed to base anything upon. Especially if we are to keep the 'feel' of the Frontier system with the distances between systems a factor in the time of travel. on the hallucinatory effects: I agree, one example that sticks in my head is that of the Star Trek movie where they go back in time to 'Save the Whales' There, the time travel experience is very hallucinatory. This could be used by devious GM's to forshadow events, point out personality flaws, etc. The only thing I took from the three cheesey Endless Quest books about Star Frontiers was from Captive Planet. One of the mark of a true 'spacer' is that of having blue stripes in their hair....from drinking water in the void. This is a device the characters can have fun with (especially the Dralasites!). We are led to believe that the spacers are a very proud lot, who are happy to call no single clump of matter their home, so they would likely drink water in the void often to get their Void Stripes. (I guess it just affects the 'head-area' on dralasites and vrusk.) roymeo
Thu, 16 Nov 1995 01:58:25 -0600 RE: questions on the Void lead to... From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu ...questions on subspace radio. How exactly does everyone else handle this. How long does it take to send a message from Gran Quivera(Prenglar) to Inner Reach(Dramune)? How big are the 'radios' needed to communicate at high speeds? Can an assault scout really hold one? questions questions... roymeo
Thu, 16 Nov 1995 12:44:20 -0500 RE: Matter at 1% From: JohnAslan@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu CC: TimC27@aol.com, DarkStarMA@aol.com to TimC27: Hmmx I can't say about the big bang, I'd need time to research it, but I have to disagree your statement concerning novas (novi?), my sources of information say that novas throw off matter at a speed of several thousand km/second, well short of the 12 MILLION km/second required to enter the void. And that's a fast nova, btw that's an actual term, slow novas throw off matter at speeds as low as 1/10th that speed. While I could not locate an exact speed for matter ejected from a supernova, even an increase in speed by an order of magnitude to several million km/second, the matter is still moving as much as 7 million km/second too slowx Also, its the star's fusion and detenation that transmutes elements, not the energy, or speed, with which they are propelled from the dying star. Regarding you relativity statement, gravity produces a warp, or well, in normal space-time, accelleration don't - at least that we know of...the warping of space-time could inhibit the Void entry. In fact a good case could be made that for that reason the Void and interstellar jumping can only be discovered well away from any gravity wells. To romeo: Light is unique in that it is both matter and energy; the matter of light, the photon, behaves as if it were energy. This unique condition might allow light to ignore or bypass the Void threshold. Also, I'd like to point out that nowhere in the TSR materials was there a mention of a Void engine or drive, certainly you couldn't buy anything like it for you ship in the Knighthawks sourcebook. As to the misjumps, once you deccellerate inside the Void, you drop back into normal space-time and, well, you have to end up somewhere. I think TSR said star systems because they wanted the lost PC's to have a chance of living thru the misjump. I think a GM could make a case for misjumping into empty interstellar space if he or she wanted to badly enough. The travel time of 1 day per lightyear comes from the Alpha Dawn rules set, written BEFORE the starship rules in Knighthawks. And Knighthawks comes very close to working that way. Actually, if a navigator spends all the time he should doing his calculations during accelleration, that's about half of the travel time! The starship flicks thru the Void for 1 to 15 seconds (a number of seconds equal to the number of lightyears jumped), and then the remaining travel time is spent decellerating into the desired system. Decelleration takes an amout of time equal to that spent accellerating, again about half the travel time. And there you have it! Its all detailed in the Knighthawks book. Finally, I like what I read concerning the superstitious nature of the spacers, DWATK00 is right space travel is every bit as dangerous, if not more so, as early ocean voyages. Superstitions should be a part of every spacer's life. There is so much that can go wrong in space, and in space when things go wrong they usually kill. Superstitious behavior about checking out and donning a spacesuit probibly keeps more spacers alive than not. Its your campaign, do it up! Romeo, I'd never heard of the spacer's Void stripes, that's a riot! P.S.: Romeo, subspace radio is covered in the Alpha Dawn rules, they talk about everything; how big it is, how fast it is, etcx
Thu, 16 Nov 95 13:20:07 EST RE: Re: questions on the Void lead to... From: delmar watkins <DWATK00@ukcc.uky.edu> To: frontiers <frontiers@uidaho.edu> OK, here's what I've always thought of subspace communication and the way it fits into my previous sketchy theory: Just as matter has the limit of the speed of light, but electromagnetic energy itself travels AT the limit, so too with tachyon travel. While frontier technology can convert matter into tachyon, this matter is still matter; it can travel faster than light but is still slower than electromagnetic polytachyon. Therefore, electromagnetic tachyon goes much faster than material tachyon. Of course, this is sonly one way to handle it, and if one takes into account the fact that void jumping only takes 15 seconds, but is slower becasue of the effort to accelerate to jump speed, while polytachyon travel at 1LY/hour (I don't know where this is stated, but I know it is somewhere) then this theory is my next choice: Jumping and Polytachyon communication is different. Jumping is the acceleration of matter and the connection of dimensions and fields to produce almost infinite travel capabilities within a short time period. Polytachyon emmissions are a special carrier wave that use similer theoretical models, but are done on a different frequency and dimension than jumping. Polytachyon is ONLY for carrier waves. In any case, subspace transmissions take 1hr/lightyear, jumping needs 1/2 day per LY for acceleration, equal for decceleration. Actually, the better quesstion (if we are to take the idea that speed is necessary for the jump, as the books say), is whether faster ships can actually jump faster because they can acc/dec faster. Food for thought. me, delmar watkins
Thu, 16 Nov 1995 17:09:23 -0500 RE: Re: Matter at 1% From: TimC27@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu RE The Void and John Aslan's comments: I humble myself before superior knowledge. I do have one question???? What about ship's exhaust? Would it also disappear as it blasted away from the ship? Dunno? What about firing a missile from the ship just before it got to .01 light? And has anyone ever figured out how long it would take at 1 g acceleration to reach .01 light? Is it anything close to what SF says?
Thu, 16 Nov 1995 18:18:34 CST RE: Re: Matter at 1% <951116124419_108114298@mail04.mail.aol.com> From: "rev. roy crisman" <roymeo@iastate.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu [of course with no base frame of reference, 1% of light relative to what? if matter is being expelled out of a star at .5%c (not that we have any evidence that it can be necessarily)than matter coming out one side is going 1%c out the other relative to the first...:)] JohnAslan said: >To ro[Y]meo: >Light is unique in that it is both matter and energy; the matter of >light, the photon, behaves as if it were energy. This unique condition >might allow light to ignore or bypass the Void threshold. It also might not. I know the whole wave-particle paradox. Course since the Void is fictional, there is no correct answer. >Also, I'd like to point out that nowhere in the TSR materials was there >a mention of a Void engine or drive, certainly you couldn't buy anything >like it for you ship in the Knighthawks sourcebook. You can't blame me for TSR's oversites. We have a perfect ship building system and no explanation for how ships get into the void. What happens when my ship travelling close to Void speed shoots a missile at the ship in front of it? Do the missiles enter the void? That's not mentioned anywhere in the Knighthawks sourcebook, either. If it was soley a matter of speed, I'd think there would be a section on 'near 1%c combat'. >As to the misjumps, once you deccellerate inside the Void, you drop back >into normal space-time and, well, you have to end up somewhere. I think >TSR said star systems because they wanted the lost PC's to have a chance >of living thru the misjump. I think a GM could make a case for >misjumping into empty interstellar space if he or she wanted to badly >enough. Whoa. First you're upholding the letter of the written word and only in this case looking for the reasoning behind it. Sure, they probably did it so it wouldn't be so bad for the players, though it still could be, as they can land in any system within the radius of the trip away from the intended target and that doesn't always mean having any civilization at all. This seems to imply that the other gravity wells would play a part in what is happening. >The travel time of 1 day per lightyear comes from the Alpha Dawn rules >set, written BEFORE the starship rules in Knighthawks. And Knighthawks >comes very close to working that way. Actually, if a navigator spends >all the time he should doing his calculations during accelleration, >that's about half of the travel time! The starship flicks thru the Void >for 1 to 15 seconds (a number of seconds equal to the number of >lightyears jumped), and then the remaining travel time is spent >decellerating into the desired system. Decelleration takes an amout of >time equal to that spent accellerating, again about half the travel >time. And there you have it! Its all detailed in the Knighthawks book. First: One could rule either way as to whether an astrogator's calculations of 10 hours per light year are able to be made during flight or not. They may need readings from the space station/ground based sources. The smallest standard jump is 4 light years. This required 40 hours. As it takes half of the four days accelerating, that gives us 2 20 hour days or exactly the time needed as long as the astrogator refuses to sleep (yeah right). So some work must be done in system anyway. I'd think most should be done pre-acceleration, because the astrogator would also have to be working while accelerating to make corrections, make sure that everything did indeed check out, etc. And what if you have any maneuvers during your acceleration? Having to spin about and shoot at that pirate ship would screw up everything, and require an entire new calculation, IMHO. Because that time wasn't accounted for, and now the various bodies accounted for are in different places. I also decided that most star systems would have pre-programmed highly-reliable astrogation programs which ships could 'download' the astrogation information from to make those charted jumps much much quicker. Of course this would also cost. But between paying a little money for accurate readings which are constantly updated (of course the astrogator still needs to play with them some, to account for ship make and model and cargo, etc.) and having to sit and wait 70 hours (+ sleep) just to do the most popular jump between cassidine and prenglar, I think most would be willing to pay. Second: Of course acceleration and deceleration each take half of the trip (minus the few seconds of void and the time it takes to turn the ship around before or after going void) Third: Yes, Alpha Dawn states the time taken to jump = 1 day/LY. Yes, Knight Hawks doesn't appear to really have any clue as to how long it takes whatsoever. (of course KH doesn't have a map of the frontier, yet we still use the AD map) And if you check the cover of the module which comes in the KH boxed set, you will see that system has the number of 'transit boxes' (which are each equal to a day of acceleration or deceleration) which is equal to the LY between systems. Thus this seems to indicate to me that instead of a simple 4 day journey between any stars, the SPEED must matter. It also indicates that TSR didn't really resolve the issue. Thus IMHO just reaching 1%c is not what causes one to go void. Thus there must be something else which does it. Or maybe simply coasting for a while and 'the navigator will accelerate slightly and the ship will enter the void.' But if that's it, kindly explain the many wasted days between systems that they are aparently spending. I'm more willing to correct for their oversight of including a void-module as part of the ship than I am to make all stars an equal number of days apart. Especially since the latter contradicts AD, and no concrete numbers are given for it what-so-ever (and i don't feel like doing the math to figure out how much time it would take to accelerate at 1g to a speed of 1%c and thus know the length of half of the journey), whereas the former is merely an oversight. These numbers also hold up well when comparing to the Dramune Run module. IE: a trip from Dramune to Gruna Garu started 3/6/61 ending 4/1/61, and there are 25 LY between the 2 systems via cassidine and prenglar. (of course it seems that the astrogation time isn't accounted for, either staying in system to do the calculations or letting the astrogator sleep at all.) >Finally, I like what I read concerning the superstitious nature of the >spacers, DWATK00 is right space travel is every bit as dangerous, if not >more so, as early ocean voyages. Superstitions should be a part of >every spacer's life. There is so much that can go wrong in space, and >in space when things go wrong they usually kill. Superstitious behavior >about checking out and donning a spacesuit probibly keeps more spacers >alive than not. Its your campaign, do it up! Ro[Y]meo, I'd never heard of >the spacer's Void stripes, that's a riot! Superstition would work to keep station-ers alive as well as anyone living near a vaccuum, as well...colonies, etc. well, like I said, the blue stripes from H2O in the void was the one thing that was actually kinda cool that I took from the 3 SF endless quest books. >P.S.: Romeo, subspace radio is covered in the Alpha Dawn rules, they >talk about everything; how big it is, how fast it is, etcx doh! yes, it is. I guess I did the classic 'think they're going to talk about it in the space book, not the ordinary book' (had the same problem with the number of days required to jump:). Now that I've seen the description, anyone wanna discuss the likelihood of people crashing on a planet and being able to 'carefully aim' the dish to actually contact anyone else? roymeo
Thu, 16 Nov 1995 16:32:21 -0800 RE: The problem with c/100... From: Roger (Brad) Jones Jr <rjones@us.oracle.com> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu There is a problem with '1% of c' as the point ships enter the void...1% of c relative to what? There is always something that you're moving at 1% of c relative to...your average electron, for example. How can we fix this? You must be moving at 1% of c relative to a large gravity well that you are inside to enter the Void. (You then activate your 'void module', or what have you). You must also be moving at 1% of c relative to a large gravity well at your destination, or you can't drop out of the Void. This also solves the misjump problem; you can only leave the Void in a large (i.e. stellar) gravity well. So you can't leave the Void in deep space...just at a star of some sort. Does this sound reasonable? -- Brad Jones (rjones@us.oracle.com), Oracle Toolkit Development Tools In the unlikely event that Oracle has opinions, these aren't them. "Why don't we just give Bill Gates ALL the money now and get it over with?" "Pride." -- Doonesbury, 17 Aug 1995
Thu, 16 Nov 1995 19:32:07 CST RE: Re: questions on the Void lead to... <951116.132919.EST.DWATK00@ukcc.uky.edu> From: "rev. roy crisman" <roymeo@iastate.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu >Actually, the better quesstion (if we are to take the idea that >speed is necessary for the jump, as the books say), is whether >faster ships can actually jump faster because they can acc/dec >faster. Food for thought. thus spoke delmar. This is one of the things I want to try to avoid in my campaign world. If the players got wind of this, no journey would be made at 1g. They'd do the little "we accelerate at 2g's and decelerate at 2g's" every time. Then i'd have to hit them or something. KH says that 1g acceleration = accelerating at one map hex per turn, so I guess any ship that can accelerate at 2 hex per turn could in fact actually cut the time in half. But as I believe the astrogator should have to do something after making the pre-flight calculations, I suppose this 'need' could require slower acceleration. roymeo
Sun, 19 Nov 1995 08:18:49 -0600 (CST) RE: scenario help From: Thorne Aaron W <awt851s@nic.smsu.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu In the next 2 days I will be starting up a Star Frontiers campaign for my brother and a couple of his friends (each person running 2 characters). I need some ideas for a good starter scenario to bring all of the characters together (non-military), and figured I'd ask everyone on the list what worked for them in the past. So what worked, guys? - Aaron Thorne
Sun, 19 Nov 1995 11:22:26 -0500 RE: Re: scenario help From: IndyCCTX@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu In a message dated 95-11-19 09:20:13 EST, you write: >I need some ideas for a good starter scenario to bring all of the >characters together (non-military), and figured I'd ask everyone on the >list what worked for them in the past. So what worked, guys? You don't mention if the players have any experience with the game. What has worked for us is using the 'Alien Creature on the Loose' adventure in the Alpha Dawn basic rule book to introduce new players to the game. It's not hard to run it with the expanded rules, or even with Zebulon's Guide to Frontier Space rules. However, for play balance, if using any psionic (Mentalist) characters, I would suggest increasing the creature's stamina by +15 per level of Beam discipline. Also, in Zeb's rules, the creature would attack on Column +1, the darts would be range B and do a max of 12 pts. If some of the players are familiar with the scenerio, just use the section on designing your own creature. Max damage in Zeb's would be 12 pts per d10, range would be A or B, and if it takes extra damage from a non-immune weapon, add 4 to max damage before calculating actual damage done. While the intro of being agents of Pan-Galactic can work, if you don't want to run the game that way, the characters could simply be civic minded (or blaster happy) people who meet while trying to stop this rampaging creature. If everybody has played the game before, the scenerio could still work, but I think it's better for new players. Alternatively, once I outfitted the creature with a bodycomp and Ani-link progit, with a Sathar spy (human) in a LSS (light shift screen) for total dark (at night) controlling it nearby. He also had an autopistol with silencers... To clean up loose ends, his bodycomp was wired to inject him with poison upon unconsiousness, or explode a small charge of TD 19 upon death. (That's up to you on how you run Sathar agents, of course; in our campaign, they tended to do that sort of thing.) That was with some experienced characters who had some decent equipment, of course. Never go on an adventure without a hat! Indy
Sun, 19 Nov 1995 11:56:08 CST RE: Re: scenario help <Pine.3.89.9511190853.B122497-0100000@nic.smsu.edu> From: "rev. roy crisman" <roymeo@iastate.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu You're all college friends. You've graduated. What now? You're all on a ship/shuttle and something BAD happens.... You look around the holding cell and survey the others in lockup...
Sun, 19 Nov 1995 13:57:14 -0500 RE: Re: scenario help From: TimC27@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu I always like a good shipwreck. Starts them in a desparate situation, lots of action, also limits their choices and equipment. Read the first SF module about crashing on Volturnus. TimC27@aol.com
Sun, 19 Nov 1995 17:55:19 -0600 (CST) RE: Re: scenario help From: Christopher Smith <heartlan@mill2.millcomm.com> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu CC: frontiers@uidaho.edu On Sun, 19 Nov 1995, rev. roy crisman wrote: > You're all college friends. You've graduated. What now? > > You're all on a ship/shuttle and something BAD happens.... One of the best campaigns I ever ran started out this way. It deviates slightly from roy's suggestion in that the characters had in fact graduated from college, but didn't know each other beforehand. I believe they were on their way from graduation to a job fair or something, and ended up in the same escape pod when the ship went down. I had the luxury of placing them on whatever planet I chose and thus controlling every possible factor. I think it ended up being about six months of sessions before they even got back to civilization again - overall one of the best campaigns I can remember. Thanks for the wistful and amusing memory, BTW! Chris
Sun, 19 Nov 1995 17:05:24 -0700 (MST) RE: Re: scenario help From: Markus Wilkinson <mark@gas.physics.usu.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu > I need some ideas for a good starter scenario to bring all of the > characters together (non-military), and figured I'd ask everyone on the > list what worked for them in the past. So what worked, guys? Employ them all as spacecraft crew members on a 15-20 man ship. Any background can be used - military are good for security, medical for crew care, robotic good for ship robots or robotic weapon systems, environmental good on life support systems. Your adventures would not be on the ship, that would just be their jobs (remember half pay is cost of living). Adventures would occur during shore leave. Mark -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Markus Wilkinson Net: mark@gas.physics.usu.edu Mail: Hughes Space and Communications, EO/E1/D112 2000 E. El Segundo Blvd, El Segundo, CA 90245, USA Phone: 310/416-4647 (work), 310/379-6165 (home) Radio: KC7IHX
Sun, 19 Nov 1995 21:11:14 -0600 (CST) RE: Why did SF fail? From: Christopher Smith <heartlan@mill2.millcomm.com> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu I'm relatively new to the mailing list, so forgive me if this question has already been debated. I thought I'd throw out a bit of food for discussion in the hopes somebody has some insight on this. Comparing copyright dates on my materials, I see that my Alpha Dawn books are copyright 1980, Knight Hawks 1983, and Zebulon's Guide 1985. I've always assumed TSR's abandoning of the Star Frontiers line was due to poor sales, but five years seems a pretty short time to judge the success of a product line, especially in the RPG market. After all, in this industry the overhead is extremely low once the material has been produced - throwing it into a second or third printing if & when necessary is pretty cheap. We're not talking about selling cars or washing machines here. And if it was poor sales, then why the poor sales? Obviously the people on this list felt (and feel) the game is worth playing, even in the face of a virtual explosion in roleplaying systems in the mid to late 80's. Are we just bizarre oddities amongst RPGers? I have a couple of theories about the demise of SF: 1. TSR lost heart when SF failed to approach the staggering success of D&D and AD&D. It was given a nearly impossible hurdle, and axed when it fell short. 2. The game itself is flawed and limited in playability. By the time Zebulon's was dispatched to remedy the problem, it was too late. By limited in playability, I mean that SF lacked some of the depth and options that games like AD&D allowed. For example, page 7 of Zebulon's states that "...professions that are not acceptable are those that are illegal...Those types of characters cannot be considered as anything but the enemy." This would effectively create a game filled with one-dimensional PC's, unlike AD&D's alignment function. And initially, anyway, the enemy was limited to Sathar (boring after the first 20 or so), bad animals that attacked the party, and shady Yazarians unloading secret boxes under cover of night. Pretty tiresome after a while. Seriously, who here has played every campaign with a group of PC's who never broke a single law? All this is not to say SF is an unplayable system - obviously I believe it is, having refereed it for so long. It's just that to make it a playable and worthwhile RPG takes a higher degree of imagination, adaptation, and committment. In the end, I guess I'd have to assume that's what killed SF. I'm eager to hear others' reactions to this - flames, too, if you think I'm really off base. Cheers, Chris (who still thinks Yazarians are as cool as any RPG race ever)
Sun, 19 Nov 1995 19:58:58 -0800 (PST) RE: Re: Why did SF fail? From: Leroy Van Camp III <van891@uidaho.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu On Sun, 19 Nov 1995, Christopher Smith wrote: > I've > always assumed TSR's abandoning of the Star Frontiers line was due to poor > sales, but five years seems a pretty short time to judge the success of a > product line, especially in the RPG market. Actually, I would say the opposite is true: five years is a long time to give a game a chance in the RPG market. If a game has gotten a luke-warm reception in its first five years, there is no reason to believe giving it a few more years is going to make a difference. At least not without major changes in the game and its supplements. And compared to the time some games today stay on the market, five years is quite a long time. > After all, in this industry > the overhead is extremely low once the material has been produced - > throwing it into a second or third printing if & when necessary is pretty > cheap. We're not talking about selling cars or washing machines here. True, but were not talking about car companies, either. TSR was not nearly as large as a comapny then as they are now. It's hard to justify putting money into something that all signs have colored a failure. > And if it was poor sales, then why the poor sales? Obviously the people > on this list felt (and feel) the game is worth playing, even in the face > of a virtual explosion in roleplaying systems in the mid to late 80's. > Are we just bizarre oddities amongst RPGers? In its beginning, I feel the biggest blow to SF was Traveller. At the time it was the science fiction game of choice for many. As time went on some people began to see xD&D as the poorly designed relic it was. And since SF was designed by the same company, they grouped it in, put it in the same category. I can remember a number of times back then mentioning Star Frontiers, and being given a look of contempt. Obviously I was a low-minded twit who hadn't learned what made a _real_ RPG. And, of course, such arrogant RPG elitism continues today. > I have a couple of theories about the demise of SF: > > 1. TSR lost heart when SF failed to approach the staggering success > of D&D and AD&D. It was given a nearly impossible hurdle, and > axed when it fell short. I am quite sure there is some truth in this. But in all fairness, I feel it was doing a _lot_ less succesfully than xD&D. I have known a lot of people who have fond memories of playing xD&D and Traveller, but only a few who played SF. > By limited in playability, I mean that SF lacked some of the depth and > options that games like AD&D allowed. For example, page 7 of Zebulon's > states that "...professions that are not acceptable are those that are > illegal...Those types of characters cannot be considered as anything but > the enemy." This would effectively create a game filled with > one-dimensional PC's, unlike AD&D's alignment function. And initially, > anyway, the enemy was limited to Sathar (boring after the first 20 or > so), bad animals that attacked the party, and shady Yazarians unloading > secret boxes under cover of night. Pretty tiresome after a while. > Seriously, who here has played every campaign with a group of PC's who > never broke a single law? > All this is not to say SF is an unplayable system - obviously I believe > it is, having refereed it for so long. It's just that to make it a > playable and worthwhile RPG takes a higher degree of imagination, > adaptation, and committment. In the end, I guess I'd have to assume > that's what killed SF. I think you hit the nail on the head here. TSR simply didn't support SF properly. The amount of background info was amazingly short. The trend in RPG's has always been approaching the "total detail" style, where people demand to be spoon fed everything. (And there is nothing wrong with this, IMO. If I play in a predesigned world, I want the details.) Compared to a lot of the games on the market at the time (1982), including AD&D, SF was a slick, well presented system. Really, take a look at the Alpha Dawn Expanded Rulebook. Well organized, well written, it was easy to understand. I ran my first SF campaign when I was 12. Actually, SF is better written and organized than several of the recent RPG's on my shelf. > I'm eager to hear others' reactions to this - flames, too, if you think > I'm really off base. No flames here. > Chris (who still thinks Yazarians are as cool as any RPG race ever) It always amused me that TSR gave the SF races a rebirth, of sorts, in their Spelljammer setting. Leroy Van Camp III van891@uidaho.edu --------------------------------------------------------------------------- "What do I know what do I know? (I), never look back never look back (no). Stick it in me stick it in me (I), what do I see what do I see? (now)" --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (A Higher Form of) Killing
Mon, 20 Nov 1995 03:18:11 CST RE: Re: Why did SF fail? <Pine.3.89.9511192041.B25133-0100000@mill2.MillComm.COM> From: "rev. roy crisman" <roymeo@iastate.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu >I'm relatively new to the mailing list, so forgive me if this question >has already been debated. I thought I'd throw out a bit of food for >discussion in the hopes somebody has some insight on this. ahoy! >Comparing copyright dates on my materials, I see that my Alpha Dawn >books are copyright 1980, Knight Hawks 1983, and Zebulon's Guide 1985. >I've always assumed TSR's abandoning of the Star Frontiers line was due >to poor sales, but five years seems a pretty short time to judge the >success of a product line, especially in the RPG market. After all, in >this industry the overhead is extremely low once the material has been >produced - throwing it into a second or third printing if & when >necessary is pretty cheap. We're not talking about selling cars or >washing machines here. >And if it was poor sales, then why the poor sales? Obviously the people >on this list felt (and feel) the game is worth playing, even in the face >of a virtual explosion in roleplaying systems in the mid to late 80's. >Are we just bizarre oddities amongst RPGers? yes, we're bizarre :) >I have a couple of theories about the demise of SF: > 1. TSR lost heart when SF failed to approach the staggering > success of D&D and AD&D. It was given a nearly impossible > hurdle, and axed when it fell short. Well, T$R has yet to produce a single game besides AD&D# which is feels deserves it's support for very long. This is also spilling into their support of the AD&D lines, where they seem to be creating a new short-lived curtains to drop behind the rules. Even most diehard D&D players are willing to admit the system is kludgy, so maybe a better question is 'why does D&D continue to thrive?' With out the sometimes fanatical devotion to AD&D some players have and the variety of pulp fantasy books they've been putting out, T$R would likely not have ANY game survive long. This discussion has been going on over in rec.games.frp.misc... Nearly every system put out has been pretty poorly done. Buck Rogers simply D&D in space... people seem to be able to overlook those 5th level fighters shrugging off arrows (which boggles me) yet don't like it when they do the same with lasers. AD&D has these problems, but the devotion to the Mother Game is enough to overcome that. We note that no other game has been held up to that 'hurdle' yet several of them have been better supported than Star Frontiers. Gamma World has had 5 revisions, plus Metamorphisis Alpha. Boot Hill had 3-5 versions. Yet Star Frontiers was dropped IN THE MIDDLE of a revision. Now if you ask me, looking for support when you've decided before the book is printed that the project is dead doesn't make much sense. Gamma World had some truely terrrible revisions yet they'd try to pick the pieces up (sometimes in such a short time they really couldn't be said to know whether the public liked the new system or not). > 2. The game itself is flawed and limited in playability. By the > time Zebulon's was dispatched to remedy the problem, it was too > late. Well, as is noted, Zebulon's wasn't even completed. It was intended to be 6 32ish page suppliments. It was axed 2/3rds of the way through, some things were left out, some things unfinished. With it in this shape, I don't know how they could have play-tested it. Instead we go about 100 pages of what happened to be typed in already...They give us the Mentalist joke, yet not the robots-bionics-cybernetics. [Question: What is the difference between cybernetics and bionics?] Something must have happened to cause this sudden rush to drop the project....more on this later. >By limited in playability, I mean that SF lacked some of the depth and >options that games like AD&D allowed. For example, page 7 of Zebulon's >states that "...professions that are not acceptable are those that are >illegal...Those types of characters cannot be considered as anything but >the enemy." How many times was it stated in Dragon (back when I played D&D) that we were only supposed to be playing good guys. > This would effectively create a game filled with >one-dimensional PC's, unlike AD&D's alignment function. And initially, >anyway, the enemy was limited to Sathar (boring after the first 20 or >so), bad animals that attacked the party, and shady Yazarians unloading >secret boxes under cover of night. Pretty tiresome after a while. Well, Star Frontiers came out before the industry had really had time to take notice of cyberpunk. Star Frontiers is based on the utopian, technology will make things better sort of paradigm. Much like the golden age sci-fi which William Gibson is railing against in The Gernsback Continuum. Making it gritty (even without the cyber part) isn't that hard. As many rules that are routinely ignored in AD&D I don't see those statements as necessarily having much effect on the playing of the game, though I guess I could see how some newbies could decide to go back to AD&D so they can kill and loot and betray the party again. >Seriously, who here has played every campaign with a group of PC's who >never broke a single law? I have. Having a Star Law officer hanging around doesn't do much for the illegality stuff. But it really isn't that hard, considering that each planet itself has a different government, different laws, different ways of handling offenses. On one world, almost nothing you could do would be illegal...on another, that rowdy hotel room is visited by the cops who kill everyone there. I've also played in a group which was set up and sent to jail though we ourselves hadn't intended to be smuggling drugs. >All this is not to say SF is an unplayable system - obviously I believe >it is, having refereed it for so long. It's just that to make it a >playable and worthwhile RPG takes a higher degree of imagination, >adaptation, and committment. In the end, I guess I'd have to assume >that's what killed SF. If someone can take a system where a person can fight a tribe of orcs, then jump off a 50' cliff and survive, I don't see rules stating that you should play good guys as that bad of a thing. Part of what makes it 'hard' to play is that since half the people who're in the hobby have never even heard of it. It's easy for most to forget about our little obsession here. And since it was an unfinished project, it doesn't help to convince people to play when you tell them that you don't know what to do about bionics. The reasons some people like Alpha Dawn is it's a very simple and shouldn't get in the way too much of the game. For some that simplicity is a turnoff, relying more on the system for character building this system produces very cardboard characters. The skill based system in Zebulon's Guide is what draws others, the problem being that Zebulon's might have been a good system if they'd have finished it. Basically, i think people who like the whole concept of the game universe, the races, the setting are the one's who supported it in some way in the past/present. I'd go to a different sci-fi game if I found one with a setting that I liked better: I want a universe small enough I can detail all of the planets/systems, not an unlimited number of races, no Earth, (rules I can use without a calculator would help). And I guess I like Star Frontiers enough to not need to bother to make up my own... >I'm eager to hear others' reactions to this - flames, too, if you think >I'm really off base. Well you've done some good analysis, and lacking some information, done a pretty good job. Now, for the real reason T$R dumped Star Frontiers mid-project. This takes a little bit of history of T$R (not that i know a lot about the history of T$R (you'll see why I use the $ soon)). The ever popular Blume brothers were execs for T$R. They were the ones more or less responsible for the aquiring of SPI by T$R and running it into the ground. They also had some stake in the Buck Rogers estate, either direct financial, or a friend/relative who had a direct financial link to the Buck Rogers estate. Thus, creating something which required licensing fees to be paid to the Buck Rogers estate would benefit them (either financially or indirectly). Thus, the Star Frontiers game was dropped IN THE MIDDLE of revision. The game wasn't dead. A company doesn't decide to revise a game that is dead and no one cares about (even a company so well known for ignoring consumer input as T$R). That wouldn't be good business at all to put the creative staff on something before being sure you would actually use it. So, people were put on the project, (the guy who LATER would be revising some of Gamma World (again) and supposedly put some of the robot/cyber stuff into Epsilon Cyborg and made a lot of the system similar to the ZG version) and somewhere 1/2 to 2/3 of the way through, the Buck Rogers idea formed. So, in order to cash in somewhat on the work that had been done they put out what had been finished, and didn't hint until a year or two later in Dragon that the game was dead dead dead despite the references about 'future editions' of Zebulon's Guide left in from the original 6 module sized design. So....our game was dropped so they could put Buck Rogers Golden Era Science Fiction stereotypes onto the AD&D classes and the whole setting dropped on top of the klunky rules for fantasy. *screams* >Cheers, >Chris (who still thinks Yazarians are as cool as any RPG race ever) Dralasites were mentioned in a Living Galaxy article by Roger E Moore as the best 'alien-feeling' alien in any game he'd run across... roymeo "A man walks into a bar, he says 'hey barkeep, can I have a drink?' The barkeep says, 'I don't know. Can you?'"
Mon, 20 Nov 1995 03:51:50 -0600 RE: more on the game discussion From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu I think one of the reasonsfor the 'stipulation' that the players play 'good guys' in the game is because of the technology available. If you just give the usual group of dungeon crawlers all the technology available in SF, the capability to create just about anything they want, they could construct an 'evil empire' without too much difficulty. We look in the Real World today and see criminals getting away with a lot (drug cartels), so the pirate players would whine when they don't get to 'win' all the time, when the cops catch them. Especially after looking at the original rulebook, one might think only in those black/white terms, and never consider the Han Solo types. And even then, I just don't see some of the obstinate players I've GM'd or played with being happy with being in the sort of financial situation Han was in. Reminds me of a story from a guy who helped start my first college SF game. The players did continue to rake in the money, much like the module hopper PC's in D&D which clean out everything in the module, and eventually had so much money that they built their own space station. Eventually they decided that was silly, and built up a second fleet of ships, and attacked their own space station, blowing it up. roymeo
Mon, 20 Nov 1995 09:50:32 -0500 (EST) RE: Re: Why did SF fail? From: jfu@riker.neoucom.edu (John C. Fu) To: frontiers@uidaho.edu > > Chris (who still thinks Yazarians are as cool as any RPG race ever) > > It always amused me that TSR gave the SF races a rebirth, of sorts, in > their Spelljammer setting. Really? How so? John Fu jfu@riker.neoucom.edu
Mon, 20 Nov 1995 08:36:20 -0700 RE: Re: Why did SF fail? -Reply From: sbartell@novell.com (Steve Bartell) To: frontiers@uidaho.edu >>> John C. Fu <jfu@riker.neoucom.edu> 11/20/95 07:50am wrote>>>> > Chris (who still thinks Yazarians are as cool as any RPG race ever) > > It always amused me that TSR gave the SF races a rebirth, of sorts, in > their Spelljammer setting. Really? How so? >>> In Spelljammers, there is a race called Hadozee that is exactly identical to yazirians - exactly. There is also a race called Rastipedes that looks just like a vrusk. There is also a sathar type creature and a dralasite type creature (I forget the names). These last two looks close enough to their SF counterparts that you can see where TSR got them, but the Hadozee and Rastipede pictures are so close you could have taken them directly from a Star Frontiers book and you would have never known the difference. -Steve Bartell http://members.aol.com/stbartell/private/index.htm "The surface world continues blindly along, never knowing the wonders, or dangers, of the UnderDeep." -Darkconch the Sage, Fathoms: Aquatic Adventures
Mon, 20 Nov 1995 08:44:23 -0700 RE: Why did SF fail? -Reply From: Steve Bartell <STEVEBAR@wordperfect.com> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Well, Star Frontiers was my first and favorite RPG game, so this was a tough one when they dropped it. OK, now this is just one of my opinions from what I saw with my friends, but I think a lot of it rests on the Zebulons Guide and flawed TSR marketing. When Zeb's guide came out, everyone I played with got it and did not really like it. Sure, they used the new races and equipment, but the core rules they just did not like (I know roymeo will disagree with this one :-) I think what everyone loved about Star Frontiers that I gamed with was the simplicity. It was easy to learn, and then easy to roleplay because there were not too many rules. The Alpha Dawn and Knighthawks rules were pretty complete for a simple game, and Zebs guide just confused everyone. I think if Star Frontiers had the same marketing as AD&D does now, it would have been highly successful and lasted longer. What I mean is, if they released the basic rules as they were, then added accessory books, it would have been the perfect game. Additional books could have been added for: -New planets - an entire book for a new planet would not be unreasonable -New equipment -New spaceships -additional creatures (kinda like a Star Frontiers Monstrous Compendium) Anyway, you see what I mean. For example, they could have made an entire softcopy book on robots, how to build them, accessories you could add, etc. This way, a robotics character could custom make a robot. I personally, would have bought every one of these accessories. Oh well, spilled milk. -Steve Bartell CLA Administrator Novell, Inc (800) 861-2505 Phone (801) 228-9511 Fax http://members.aol.com/stbartell/private/index.htm
Mon, 20 Nov 1995 10:46:18 CST RE: Re: Why did SF fail? -Reply <s0b0400a.081@WordPerfect.com> From: "rev. roy crisman" <roymeo@iastate.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu My Email SF GM said: >When Zeb's guide came out, everyone I played with got it and did not >really like it. Sure, they used the new races and equipment, but the >core rules they just did not like (I know roymeo will disagree with >this one :-) My name was invoked, so I have to speak up. Ok, the new races sucked. They gave us a halfling that looks like a dwarf, a kangaroo with a really fucking nasty attitude, and this other thing. The Mentalist was completely what I do NOT look for in my science fiction (the X-files make me giggle...half badly thought out concepts, half the acting/lines). But that was 'optional' (I have a date in my timeline when all the people with psionic powers or genetic possibilities for it were executed/sterilized. When my psionic-freak friend asks to play one, I respond sure...but we start on that date.) (someone ought to ask me about the mentalist chef someday...). But the thing that totally opened my T$R games I could find in Waldenbooks world was that instead of the lame cardboard 'class' system, here we were given a skill based system. Sure there are some 'templates' given for those skills, but now we can truely customize the character's skills. This came about just as i was becomming frustrated with the whole D$D class system limitations. It's basically that which has me devoted to the new system. And I'm devoted to the game for the background. I'm also a Zeb fan because of the new background. The shift from pre-cyberpunk utopian Sci-fi to a somewhat more gritty version with the Megacorps being bastards who wage war against each other instead of the 'PGC is your friend and employer and fighting most patriotically for the Frontier' bs. I really don't think it's possible to have too much speculation on Zebulon's Guide sales, publicity, and maybe even system. I doubt it was playtested; playtested means all the material would have been ready to go to press when the axe fell. Sales? How can you judge sales when it was never finished? Publicity for a game that they're dropping mid-project? Everyone I know who followed the game at that time now has several copies of ZG (I have 3 (had 4)). I think I saw more advertisements in Dragon for Gammarauders (a board game I believe) than I ever did for ZG. When Buck came out there was a dragon dedicated to it. They never pushed the game that was a revolution in T$R thought: no classes. of course it had already been targeted for death. So, while arm-chair speculation is fun, I don't think any factor other than Buck Rogers looming in the shadows like the bloated body of a Sathar feasting on Vrusk eggs had much of anything to do with the games demise. roymeo .sigs suck
Mon, 20 Nov 1995 12:41:05 -0500 RE: Re: Why did SF fail? -Reply From: TimC27@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu I don't know why SF failed, other than it was a real shakeout time at T$R. The company was directionless at the time, maybe still is. Witness the ridiculous revisionizing on Gamma World. Editions 2 and 3 really destroyed the spirit of the game, and took it in wild and unpopular directions (remember that doofy stuff in GWIII about Alien Technology and the Cities of Man?). Moreover, the number of typos and just plain dumb mistakes showed a genuine lack of attention to business. What about that? Were they simply dumping anything to do with G.Gygax? That stuff about (mega)buck Rogers is classic. That rings so true! Ah, well, my thoughts.... Tim
Mon, 20 Nov 1995 12:41:26 -0500 RE: Re: Why did SF fail? -Reply From: TRichar732@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Bravo!!! Well Said!!!!
Mon, 20 Nov 1995 19:02:01 -0800 RE: Star Frontiers & Buck Rogers From: Mark Damon Hughes <kamikaze@kuoi.asui.uidaho.edu> To: frontiers@crow.csrv.uidaho.edu One thing to keep in mind here is that it's T$R that's at fault, not the Buck Rogers game itself. I point this out because despite the horrid T$R-standard rules, the XXVc game had a brilliant background - half Vingeian post-singularity SF, part space opera (it's not much like the comic, the original novels, or any of the TV shows). I've stolen parts of it (the half-terraformed worlds with genengineered humans living on them and a number of the gizmos) for Star Frontiers, even, and it's worked well. -Mark Damon Hughes
Tue, 21 Nov 1995 00:29:51 CST RE: Re: Star Frontiers & Buck Rogers <199511210302.TAA02516@kuoi.asui.uidaho.edu> From: "rev. roy crisman" <roymeo@iastate.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Mark Damon Hughes noted that the Buck game isn't much like any of the sources it came from. I suppose that's what happens when you take a Golden Era sci-fi story/universe and explain it with the technology of modern science fiction. (I won't say cyberpunk because cyberpunk is about attitude, not gizmos.) I wonder how exactly the cleri---I mean medical types in BR heal people. There doesn't seem to be any medical supplies noted in any of the books. roymeo
Tue, 21 Nov 1995 08:22:33 -0500 RE: Re: Star Frontiers & Buck Rogers From: TimC27@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu I never even bothered to pick up BR. Was it really DND with rocket belts? Were the PC's rolled the same, etc? Also, does it really matter what the system is? Doesn't the real strength of role-playing come from how the GM and the players interact? If so, then maybe that explains the continued popularity of DND... It doesn't matter if the system is a kludge because people don't pay that much attention to it. I can't tell you how many times a DM has told me that I took an arrow in the arm and that arm is pretty much useless. It may still have only cost me 6hps of damage, but the DM has interpreted it that way and that's all that matters. TimC27@aol.com
Tue, 21 Nov 1995 11:59:11 -0800 RE: Re: Star Frontiers & Buck Rogers From: Mark Damon Hughes <kamikaze@kuoi.asui.uidaho.edu> To: frontiers@crow.csrv.uidaho.edu Really, roymeo? You didn't see ANY medical equipment? Not even in the Medicine chapter in the Technology Book? True, it's only about 3 pages, but that's pretty good in a 32-page booklet... Life Suspension devices are also described in the combat section and in the World Book. The Autosurgery is a particularly nice piece of hard science - an expert system and waldoes that can do what nurses and assisting doctors do in a modern hospital, leaving the medic free to do the more complex procedures. While I can think of other things to bitch about on XXVc, like the classes and the AD&D combat system (as I've pointed out on gmast-l, "the rules blow but they're easily ported to a real system"), there's no problem with the doctors of the 25th century - they're certainly much more detailed than those in Star Frontiers. Here's some things to bitch about: The maneuvering and attacks in the space combat system (the rest of the rocket ship rules are not too bad, but nowhere near as good as Knight Hawks). The world computers and the huge amount of room Digital Personalities supposedly require (completely ignoring every trend in computer science) - also the limitations on copying and backups. (I don't use AIs or DPs in my SF games, for reasons explained at the start of my house rules, but if I was running XXVc by itself these would REALLY break my suspension of disbelief). No unguided slugthrowers (except Buck Rogers' .45). Using the fucking English measurement system in the supposed 25th century. There are probably more, but those are the obvious ones. These are the casualties of squeezing a hard SF game past the Dille Familia ("we're gonna make you an offah you can't refuse...") in the guise of Buck Rogers. -Mark Damon Hughes
Tue, 21 Nov 1995 20:36:18 CST RE: Re: Star Frontiers & Buck Rogers <199511211959.LAA04750@kuoi.asui.uidaho.edu> From: "rev. roy crisman" <roymeo@iastate.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu ah...well, I didn't purchase it for myself, only looked over someone else's copy, and apparently not that well, either. I thought I came away with the feeling the medics were clerics and must be healing via magic. *shrug* roymeo
Wed, 22 Nov 1995 18:45:48 -0500 RE: Mentalist class From: IndyCCTX@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu I think our new ref for Star Frontiers will be using the Mentalist class. If anybody has any comments (pro or con), suggestions for use in a campaign, or rules changes for play balance I'd like to hear them, and will pass appropriate ones along to him. Also, I just came up with a new device for my Techex to invent. Any comments or suggestions would be welcomed. (Anyone who's read Asimov's 'Second Foundation' should recognize the inspiration for this.) Psionic Scrambler This device broadcasts random patterns of brainwave frequencies. It is powered by an SEU microdisk for 10 days (but see below). It prevents the use of Telepathy, Empathy, or Illusion disciplines on creatures within 5m of the device, and further gives a -2 CS on the use of other disciplines targeted on a creature within that area. The device can also be used at high power, and uses 1 SEU/hour. The area of effect is increased to 50m, and additionally causes a -5 CS, -1 RS within 20m, or a -10 CS, -2 RS within 5m (in this case, a 01-02 cobalt becomes a blue result). Note that these modifiers are not cumulative (-10 at the center, not -17). When on high power, a mentalist takes -1 CS on ALL disciplines as long as (if) he's within 20m, and for as long afterwards as he was in the field. A mentalist takes a -2 CS on ALL disciplines while he's within 5m, and for afterwards for the same amount of time, then a -1 CS for as long as he was within 20m (counting time within 5m, of course). Note that the -1 or -2 CS are not cumulative with each other, or the other column shifts for targets inside the area of effect; use the highest that applies. Any mentalist will notice such a field upon entering it (or when close to it) and the approximate direction of the center. Telepathy or Empathy use will detect such a field if a normal check for the discipline succeeds with no negative modifiers. Each minute of high power use there is a non-cumulative 1% chance for burnout or overheating. Never go on an adventure without a hat! Indy IndyCCTX@aol.com (The Junkman)
Wed, 22 Nov 1995 23:31:55 -0500 RE: Re: Why did SF fail? -Reply From: RobertH508@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu In a message dated 95-11-20 11:49:32 EST, you write: >several copies of ZG (I have 3 (had 4)). I think I saw more >advertisements in Dragon for Gammarauders (a board game I believe) than >I ever did for ZG. When Buck came out there was a dragon dedicated to >it. They never pushed the game that was a revolution in T$R thought: >no classes. of course it had already been targeted for death. I agree. I have always been a big fan of SF and just found out around 2 years ago that there was even such a thing as Zeb's guide. Finally got one though.
Sat, 25 Nov 1995 03:29:23 -0600 RE: roymeo's item list (again) From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu There's actually some changes in the polyhedron stuff now. (as if anyone but me is paying attention to this stuff, anyway...) Alpha Dawn Boxed Set Basic Rules Expanded Rules Map, 2d10, Counters SF0 Crash On Volturnus Module Knight Hawks Boxed Set Tactical Operations Manual Campaign Book Map, 2d10, Counters SFKH0 Warriors of White Light SFAC1 Character Sheets (AD) SFAC2 ?? Referee's Screen + Assault on Starship Omicron Mini-Mod SFAC3 Zebulon's Guide to Frontier Space SF1 Volturnus Planet of Mystery SF2 Starspawn of Volturnus SF3 Sundown on Starmist SF4 Mission to Alcazzar SF5 Bugs In The System SF6 Dark Side of the Moon SFKH1 Dramune Run SFKH2 Mutiny on the Eleanor Moraes SFKH3 Face of the Enemy SFKH4 The War Machine 2001 A Space Odyssey 2010 Odyssey Two _ENDLESS QUEST Books_: These are about a Jr High reading level. #8 Villains of Volturnus #17 Captive Planet #24 Mission on Artule (exceptionally BAD, Earth is in the system, no other UPF character races but 6 anon. Yaz thugs. Not really StarFron) __DRAGON MAGAZINE__ __TITLE__ __SUBJECT__ __SOURCE__ Blastoff! First Look at SF Review Dragon 65 The SF 'Universe' Detailed Review Dragon 74 Zethra, The New Race Dragon 84 StarQuestions Q&A (from Polyhedrons) Dragon 85 Fast and Deadly Starships Dragon 86 Freeze! Star Law! Law Enforcement Dragon 87 Battle of Ebony Eyes Mini-Mod, Black Holes Dragon 88 StarQuestions Q&A Dragon 88 Yachts and Privateers Return Starships Dragon 88 The Mighty Mega-Corporations Mega-Corps, History(in Zeb) Dragon 89 Mega-Corporations o.t. Frontier Mega-Corps, History(in Zeb) Dragon 90 Careers in Star Law Law Enforcement Dragon 91 Day of the Juggernaut Mini-Mod, Huge Ship Dragon 91 StarQuestions Q&A Dragon 92 Rare Wines and Ready Cash Agricultural Trade Dragon 93 >From Anarchy to Empire Governments Dragon 94 Zuraqqor Strike Back, The New Race, Mini-Mod, Starships Dragon 95 Coming of the S'sessu, The New Race, Sathar Dragon 96 StarQuestions Q&A Dragon 97 StarQuestions Q&A Dragon 98 Volturnus Connection, The Volturnus Dragon 98 Tanks a Lot! Vehicle Combat Dragon 99 SilverTwin Star Law Enforcement, Vehicle Dragon 102 Saurians, The New Race Dragon 103 Tanks Again! Vehicle Combat Dragon 103 Star Law Returns Law Enforcement Dragon 104 Expanding the Frontier Exploring Dragon 105 Tote That Barge! Interstellar Economics Dragon 107 Old Yazirians Never Die Age and Aging Dragon 108 Patriots, Terrorists, & Spies Cults Dragon 109 Going For a Swim? Underwater Adventures Dragon 110 For a Fistfull of Credits New Items Dragon 112 Interstellar Armory, A New Starship Arms Dragon 115 Here Comes the Cavalry Warfare Dragon 120 Leader of the Pack, The Leadership Dragon 122 Whole-Earth Ecology, The Aliens Dragon 123 Shot in the Arm, A Damage System Dragon 124 Second Look at Zebulon's Guide Zeb Guide Errata Dragon 125 Armored and Dangerous Powered Armor Dragon 129 Frontiers of Design, The Starship Building System Dragon 132 Sage Advice Q&A, AD, Zeb Guide Dragon 135 Damage Control--Report! Starship Combat Dragon 136 ("Jetboots, Dont fail me now!") revised movement rules (Dragon 139) Sage Advice Q&A, DD, ADD, SF Dragon 144 >From Freighters to Flying Boats Ships, Boats, Ocean Dragon 149 __POLYHEDRON NEWSZINE (RPGA)__ 9 SF review:pg5 + Encounters:pg8 10 dispel confusion:pg7 [&dc] (11) (dispel confusion:pg9) (12) (KH 'feature' review?:pg14) + [dispel confusion:pg12] (13) (Raid on Theseus KH:pg20) + (dispel confusion:pg7) 14 Ambush on Lossend SF:pg22-23 + dispel confusion:pg11 (15) (cardstock reference sheet KH) + (dispel confusion:pg13) (16) (dispel confusion:pg32-33) (17) [dispel confusion:pg32-33] 18 Layover at Lossend SF:pg25 + dispel confusion:pg30-31 [&dc] (19) (The Laser Pod KH:pg28-29) + (dispel confusion:pg32) (20) The Proton Beam:pg8-9 + dispel confusion:pg30 (21) Take Command of a Titan!:pg10-11 (22) Of Great Ships and Captains:p26-28 + dispel confusion:pg25 (27) dispel confusion:pg26 (31) (dispel confusion:pg29) NOTE: I do not own anything in ()'s scanned softcopy in []'s __Ares Magazine__ (14) ??? (15) Von Neumann machines, Into the Void module 17 Yazirian Cultural Weapon + Miniature Use (Ares Special Edition #2) Frontiers of the Mind(psionics) __Miniatures__ Spacefarers (12) Player Characters/Spacers(?) (12) Robots (6) Federation Ships (6)(with miniatures rules conversions) Sathar and Pirate Ships (6) (Yachts and Privateers(6)) (Vehicles) (vaporware??: rules for new vehicles like grav tanks) (various blisterpacks) __THE LIVING GALAXY__ (from POLYHEDRON) Database Is Your Friend, The Polyhedron 51 Brainstorming The Universe Polyhedron 52 No Two Urban Jungles Should Be Alike Polyhedron 53 Satellites: Part 1 Polyhedron 54 Satellites: Part 2 Polyhedron 55 Opponents Make The World Go Round Polyhedron 57 The Alienization of Alien Nations Polyhedron 58 Recycling Planets Polyhedron 59 Spacecraft PC, Part I Polyhedron 60 Spacecraft PC, Part II Polyhedron 61 Spacecraft PC, Part III Polyhedron 62 Flawed Gems Shine The Brightest Polyhedron 63 Death Takes A Holiday Polyhedron 64 A Thrill in Every Port Polyhedron 65 All That Glitters Sure Is Nice: Part I Polyhedron 66 All That Glitters Sure Is Nice: Part II Polyhedron 67 To The Stars Polyhedron 68 Do Starships Dream Of Jumpspace sheep? Polyhedron 69 Better Heroes, Better Cities Polyhedron 70 A Little Planet Looks Awfully Big Close Up: Part 1 Polyhedron 71 A Little Planet Looks Awfully Big Close Up: Part 2 Polyhedron 72 No World Like Home Polyhedron 73 A Sprinkling of Stardust: Odds and Ends for Campaigns Polyhedron 74 Case of the Missing Adventures Polyhedron 75 Save the Last Danse Macabre For Me Polyhedron 76 Adventures From Your Library, Part 1 Polyhedron 77 Weirdo SF Adventurers Polyhedron 78 Ice Dwarfs and Magsails Polyhedron 79 Barbarian Planets I Polyhedron 80 Barbarian Planets II Polyhedron 81 A Stellar Game Master Is Made, Not Born Polyhedron 82 Stellar Game Master, Part 2 Polyhedron 83 Reshaping History For Fun And Games Polyhedron 84 In The National Interest: Countries On Other Worlds Polyhedron 85 Flora, Fauna, And The Alien Question Polyhedron 86 Creating NPC's for Adventures Polyhedron 87 Not Quite 101 Uses For A Dead Module(using SF Modules) Polyhedron 88 Epic Campaigns: one Polyhedron 89 Epic Campaigns: two Polyhedron 90 Epic Campaigns: three Polyhedron 91 Times Three Adventure Creation Method Polyhedron 92 One-Character Adventures: one Polyhedron 93 One-Character Adventures: two Polyhedron 94 Military History and Science Fiction Campaigns Polyhedron 95 Many Aliens of Earth, The Polyhedron 96 Whither The Weather? Polyhedron 97 Idea Catcher: Generating Ideas Polyhedron 98 New View of Space Colonies Polyhedron 99 Fantasy Fixes for SF Gaming's Black Holes Polyhedron 101 Carrots, Sticks, and Mysteries in Space Polyhedron 103 TV Shows: one Polyhedron 104 TV Shows: two Polyhedron 105 TV Shows: three Polyhedron 106 Adventure Driver Polyhedron 107 Alternate Histories: one Polyhedron 108 Alternate Histories: two Polyhedron 109 Alternate Histories: three Polyhedron 110 This is also located on my SF WWW page. I'll probably stop sending it now that I have it there.... http://www.public.iastate.edu/~roymeo/StarFron/sfpage.html roymeo (who wonders if anyone will even read down this far)
Sat, 25 Nov 1995 03:47:10 -0600 RE: a couple of vrusk planets From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu critique (as always) welcome K'AKEN-KAR Ken'zah-Kit Moons: None Gravity: 0.9 Day: 25 hours Year: Diameter: Inclination: 0 Orbit: Atmosphere: Climate Range: Average Surface Temperature: 0 % Water: Trade: Agriculture, Business General Notes: Though the government of Ken'zah-Kit may parallel certain socialist societies, it's appearance is very much as a corporation controlled society. Terrain/Climate: Life: Native Species: Tick-tock Trees History: Discovered by Vrusk in 280 pf. Task Force Prenglar regrouped in this system in FY97 during SWII. Sent an exploratory team to the Debaran system in FY127.8. A starliner was hijacked from this sytem and take to Arsolus(Debaran) by pirates in FY128.2. Government: Ken'zah-Kit is a company owned planet. The government itself is Ken'zah Inc. Since nearly every native inhabitant works for the company, the government boasts the highest active participation by ruled members on the Frontier. Ken'zah Inc. is the company which was originally formed to facilitate the Flight of the Vrusk (see Kit-Kit(Kar)). Ken'zah Inc.'s sole purpose as a corporation is to look after the well being of the inhabitants of the planet. It is thus a non-expansionistic corporation, and profits are generally used to better the environment of the planet and well-being of its workforce/populace. All of the business done by Ken'zah Inc.'s ultimate goal is to better the planet. Smaller businesses which aren't associated with KI are allowed to exist so as to provide competition for capitalistic impetus. These businesses pay taxes as if located in any other capitalistic government structure and are able to survive quite well if they are able to produce better goods. These businesses also help to keep 'rebels' of society satiated. KI is responsible for the education of the children of the planet, and ultimately ends up employing the vast majority of them. Thus the company controls the lives of its citizens, but has quite a broad education system, as opposed to creating mindless robots tailored for certain positions. Those who do not wish to work for KI are not penalized, though occasionally pitied. Law: (CR 3) Weapons 6. No weapons are allowed to be carried by the general populace. Laws on other issues are generally far less controlling. If it's bad for business, it's bad for the planet. Population: Vrusk Heavy Society/Culture: The culture of Ken'zah is much like a streamlined version of what once existed on Kit-Kit(Kar). It has become 'streamlined' due to the merger of the society into a single corporation. Those who do not give their all for their job and thus the planet are held in very low regard. Most cases of violence reported on the planet is against those who seem to take more than they produce, slack, etc. This has on occasion led to violence against handicapped individuals, special interest groups, etc. There is also on occasion some hostility towards those beings who after being educated by the KI company leave the fold. Vrusk on Ken'zah-Kit almost never say their company name before their own, as that is almost a universal (and thus a waste of energy). Vrusk who do not work for the company (and other races) are required to use their company name first. % Kra K'ow City: Starport. % Valentina City: K'onklave Complex located there, as well as a Vrusk Center for Children. % Southern Kalph: University of Southern Kalph: sciences and astrophysics *' Doliin Bay: FSS This, the first space station in orbit, was taken by the Sathar at the beginning of the SWII. (where did this come from?????***###)(tom2) *' Ken'Zah Station: TS (4) KAR (EPSILON) Kit-Kit Moons: (2) Kar'k-Tik, Zkik-Kzir-Tik Gravity: 1.105 Day: 30 hours Year: 300 days, 15 hours Diameter: Inclination: 0 Orbit: Atmosphere: Climate Range: Average Surface Temperature: 200C % Water: Trade: None General Notes: This is the Vrusk homeworld. It was abandoned and returned somewhat to its pre-civilization state because the Vrusk had depleted it, its proximity to the Ebony Eyes binary black holes, and Vrusk aesthetics. Terrain/Climate: Life: Native Species: History: Kit-Kit became so infected with the Blue Plague virus that it was put under quarantine in FY58. Many inhabitants died before the Plague was eradicated and the ban lifted in FY67. In FY71 the system was unreachable for an entire month, as an change in the gravitational fields of the Ebony Eyes singularities caused ships to misjump. The black holes had to be re-mapped to set up new astrogation charts. The following year the gravitational fields continued to change, causing many misjumps and required constant study to produce astrogation charts which soon expired. Because of these constant astrogation problems, the far future danger of the black holes upon the planet, observations of the effects of the Blue Plague upon the Human and Dralasite home worlds, and Vrusk aesthetics the Vrusk decide to vacate their home world. They chose to leave their world on their own terms, as opposed to having it take away from them (as well as the loss of profitability of a hard to reach planet). Vrusk corporations began moving headquarters to other locations and the population gradually began to shift to other worlds. In FY76 the Vrusk cease the releasing of astrological information necessary to reach the system. Vrusk ships are kept updated, so they may ferry away people and cargo, they also charter a great many ships from other organizations. On FY85.1.18, the Vrusk have completely evacuated the planet. Moreover, they have removed all obvious traces possible of their civilization, leaving the planet in it's pre-Vrusk state as much as was possible. The entire system is seeded with robot drones (some of which left over from the Blue Plague quarantine) which detect and warn trespassers as well as having a large arsenal. One moon base on Kar'k-Tik is left in case of emergency situations. It is during this final period of inhabitation that the Vrusk Lottery is conceived of. Sixteen Vrusk are given a chance each year to return to their home world for an entire local month sabbatical. The Lottery occurs annually (Kar time) on the anniversary of the leaving of the system (FY82.1.18) plus one FYday each year to account for local time. No winning Vrusk has ever refused or forfeited their trip. It is believed that no non-Vrusk knows about the Lottery. Government: Law: Trespass is a capital crime. Population: None. 16 at most. Society/Culture: ' Kar'k-Tik: The only structure left over from the Vrusk civilization is a base left here to deal with emergency situations. This is also the rendezvous point for the Vrusk Lottery winners and the debarkation point for their trip to the planet. ' Zkik-Kzir-Tik:
Sun, 26 Nov 1995 15:11:32 -0500 RE: Re: roymeo's item list (again) From: TRichar732@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu In a message dated 95-11-25 04:31:32 EST, you write: >roymeo (who wonders if anyone will even read down this far) Yes we do. :)
Sun, 26 Nov 1995 21:22:25 -0600 (CST) RE: Where did humans come from? From: Christopher Smith <heartlan@mill2.millcomm.com> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Ok, here's a topic I got asked several years ago, back when I was actively playing SF. I'd like to see what others have come up with. Right before the gaming session begins (the universally traditional time for stump-the-ref questions from players), my no-trouble, always-courteous veteran Human player leans over and says: "So if I'm human, why can't I go back and visit Earth?" After performing the obligatory head-smack, I checked the human description section in the Expanded Rules, and there's not even a hint of an explanation for this. Every other race has a homeworld, and they know where that homeworld is. Note that I'm assuming Earth is the homeworld for humans, and sidestepping all that "Chariots of the Gods" business where the lost escape pod of uberhumans crashes into Earth and for some reason, they breed with the ape people they find here to eventually create you and me. I'm interested in that span of time between the first viable human starship and first contact with one of the SF races. And why the humans can't find their way back. "Because I'm the ref, that's why. Now bring me the Doritos." Actually, I can't remember what I told him. I believe it was something like "Well, about 150 years after the first megacolonies were established off Earth, a horrible cosmic disaster of some sort transformed every last one of the left-behind humans into mindless, savage, drooling mutants and the astrogation maps were ordered destroyed. Then your race found Yazarians and you really hit it off, so together you decided to look for other races." Of course the drooling mutants thing REALLY made him want to find Earth, and it took the combined logic of both Vrusk in the group to eventually talk him out of it. In short, this cockeyed story suited my purposes at the time, but I'd always sought a more comprehensive, polished answer. Anybody got one? Chris
Sun, 26 Nov 95 23:16:20 EST RE: RE: Where did humans come from? From: "Eric Pawtowski" <epawtows@vt.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu In Message Sun, 26 Nov 1995 21:22:25 -0600 (CST), Christopher Smith <heartlan@mill2.millcomm.com> writes: >Right before the gaming session begins (the universally traditional time >for stump-the-ref questions from players), my no-trouble, always-courteous >veteran Human player leans over and says: > > "So if I'm human, why can't I go back and visit Earth?" Hey, not a problem. Our local game re-drew the map. Sol is about 40 light years from Cassadine, and is probably better-defended. If you think task force Cassadine is something to look at, you should see task force Terra! Eric -- epawtows@vt.edu--------------------------------------------------- Technicon 13- SF&F return to the New River Valley in SW VA! March 22-24, 1996! L.E. Modesitt, Lori&Corey Cole, Ruth Thompson
Mon, 27 Nov 1995 07:30:09 -0600 RE: sale not auction From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu From: gameguy108@aol.com (Gameguy108) Organization: America Online, Inc. (1-800-827-6364) Date: 27 Nov 1995 06:27:25 -0500 Subject: Marvel & SFrontiers $4 BLOWOUT All items are in the shrink/new. They are $4 each before shipping. They are being sold on a first come fisrt serve basis, although I have some multiples of items. Trades will be considered. MARVEL MHAC1 Judges Screen MHAC2 Avengers Assembled MHAC4 Adventure Fold Ups MHAC5 Project Wide Awake MHAC6 New York, New York MHAC7 Concrete Jungle (Long live Bob Marley!) MHAC8 Weapons Locker MHAC9 Realms of Magic MA1 Children of the Atom MH1 The Breeder Bombs MH2 Time Trap MH3 Murderworld! -- 07:09 --.frp.marketplace-- LAST --help:?--Top 51%-- MH2 Time Trap MH3 Murderworld! MH4 Lone Wolves MH5 Cat's Paw MH6 Thunder on....(Can't read my own scribble!) MH7 The Last Resort MH8 Half Lane MH9 The Gates of Waht? MA2 Avengers Coast to Coast MHSP-2 Secret Wars 2 STAR FRONTIERS SF1 Volturnus:Planet of Mysteries SF2 Starspawn on Volturnus SF3 Sundown on Star Mist SFKH1 Dramune Run SFKH2 Mutiny on the Elenor Morans SFKH3 Face of the Enemy SFKH4 The War Machine 2010 Odyssey SFAD5 Bugs in the System SFAD6 Darkside of the Moon
Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:03:43 -0500 RE: Re: Where did humans come from? From: TimC27@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Oh, I forgot why I disregarded the rules in the first place. I love the use of cultural references from Earth History, you know, like quoting Shakespeare, and so forth. Plus I never understood why the rules said they weren't from Earth. Made no good sense to me. TimC27@aol.com
Mon, 27 Nov 1995 09:02:15 -0500 RE: Re: Where did humans come from? From: TimC27@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu In my own ancient SF campaign (when they were still publishing stuff, and even before Knighthawks was released, I disregarded the rule books dictum that Humans in SF were not the same as Humans from Earth, and in fact were discreetly evolved. I placed the SF worlds in a local group or globular cluster that was impossibly far from Earth. The journey was slow and costly and dangerous, and even upon arrival, Earth was dull dull dull. The frontier thus became what a frontier should be, an exciting place of do-it-yourselfers who fled the overly civilized systems. In fact, one of my characters was a fugitive from Earth, an anarchist of sorts rebelling against the restrictive government. TimC27@aol.com
Mon, 27 Nov 1995 17:55:26 CST RE: Re: Where did humans come from? <Pine.3.89.9511262019.A13046-0100000@mill2.MillComm.COM> From: "rev. roy crisman" <roymeo@iastate.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Well, as far as the official cannon is concerned, there are NO HOMEWORLDS for any of the races. If you go through the timeline presented in the ZG, you find that every planet in the frontier has a time of discovery given (except Krataar(Tristkar) and the plague worlds (alpha beta delta epsion and gamma) (and given that the plague was cured, there seems to be no reason to ignore them...)). >From the Dragon article From Anarchy to Empire (i think) it seems that we are supposed to create human-space, dral-space, yaz space, and vrusk-space for ourselves. 1) I have enough problem fleshying out the Frontier myself, let alone letting the players go somewhere else 2) If there are other regions of space, would not they be worried about the Frontier being overrun with sathar and helping the Frontier to fight the Sathar? 3) I like the Frontier the size it is, isolated from other issues even if I wasn't having to worry about the players going there and having to flesh them out. so, i personally decided 4 of the plague planets were the homeworlds. there is at LEAST one plague world very near the first planet listed in the timeline as 'discovered by (race x)'. So these in my mind make very good candidates for the racial homeworlds. Then I found ways to taking each homeworld out of the game: yaz moon obliterates homeworld human nuclear warfare fighting over blue plague serum dral blue plague undergoes change reacting to basic life struc vrusk abandons planet which is only 2 LY away from the binary black holes as noted in the Dragon article "Battle of Ebony Eyes" (note: According to some history somewhere the Vrusk first discovered Void-drive and told the Dralasites. These two eventually made contact with Humans. As they were preparing to meet, they discovered the Yazirians and then the frontier meeting was held (on Gran Quivera(Prenglar) i think).) This timeline is very silly with each race having their own areas of space. The Frontier should have been crawling with all the races a long time ago and very quickly. And I'd think the Rim would have been found in this same timeperiod as well... Mainly, the politics of the Frontier are complex enough for me to suddenly have to include all these other outside factors. if I wanted a game-universe exanding from humanEarth and encompassing so many worlds that I couldn't even name a quarter of them, I'd not be playing a game which has been discontinued for 10 years; I'd be playing traveller. I know it's kind of annoying to not be able to have Shakespeare quotes and 1812 black-powder front-loading revolvers (or was that a 1870-80 gun? had a guy who HAD to make them for his Vrusk *shudder*), but I also feel that having the diverse human background makes the other races seem much more cardboard. Maybe I'll talk with my players and see what they want to do...and see what most people here have done... If you had to choose between Earth is not even in the same Universe and will never be 'discovered' OR Earth is the human homeworld located in the spot I assigned it (plague planet nearest Timeon) and was destroyed in nuclear hostilities during the Blue Plague which would you choose? roymeo (who is rambling because he spent all day working on specifying a program with his 400 level group in a language that we know of only from the notes his professor gives as the professor created it and there is no book to look anything up in)
Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:00:57 CST RE: Re: Where did humans come from? <Pine.3.89.9511262019.A13046-0100000@mill2.MillComm.COM> From: "rev. roy crisman" <roymeo@iastate.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Chris said: >After performing the obligatory head-smack, I checked the human >description section in the Expanded Rules, and there's not even a hint >of an explanation for this. Every other race has a homeworld, and they >know where that homeworld is. Though I said this in the post I just sent, I thought I'd state this again: None of the 4 frontier races is given a homeworld whatsoever. the only planets in the frontier on the Zeb guide map which they could have come from according to the zg timeline is the 5 plague planets and/or Krataar(Tristkar) because those are the only ones mentioned with no discovery date. and it seemed from some of the Dragon articles we were supposed to come up with our own home systems feh on that roymeo
Mon, 27 Nov 1995 18:07:34 CST RE: Re: Where did humans come from? <951127090212_35220444@emout05.mail.aol.com> From: "rev. roy crisman" <roymeo@iastate.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu TimC said: I placed the SF worlds in a local group or globular cluster that was impossibly far from Earth. The journey was slow and costly and dangerous, and even upon arrival, Earth was dull dull dull. The frontier thus became what a frontier should be, an exciting place of do-it-yourselfers who fled the overly civilized systems. ----- This almost seems acceptable, as long as all the 4 race's planets are really really far away. But I'd think there'd be lots of new people coming from the home-systems, kind of like frontier west america. Beings wanting to go where they could own guns, etc. Even this stars to beg a lot of questions on politics, why here, etc. etc. There would have had to been a large influx of people to colonize the frontier systems, from all sorts of cultures to flesh out which are different from frontier cultures and are still arriving every day (unless they're no longer allowed to leave. ...) wouldn't the racist HUSP's just go home? gah... too much to deal with roymeo
Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:25:34 -0500 RE: Re: Where did humans come from? From: TimC27@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Roymeo Says >This almost seems acceptable, as long as all the 4 race's planets are >really really far away. But I'd think there'd be lots of new people >coming from the home-systems, kind of like frontier west america. >Beings wanting to go where they could own guns, etc. >Even this stars to beg a lot of questions on politics, why here, etc. >etc. There would have had to been a large influx of people to colonize >the frontier systems, from all sorts of cultures to flesh out which are >different from frontier cultures and are still arriving every day >(unless they're no longer allowed to leave. ...) >wouldn't the racist HUSP's just go home? Uhm, I solve it by saying it happens the way I want it to happen. Full Stop. I am the GM and if I don't want to deal with a lot of other cultures, I find some way to put a crimp in it: An newly manifested energy field that makes navigation to the frontier daunting; a fairly comfortable situation on the home front; rumors of the bloody Sathar Wars. The point is I can open it up as much as I am comfortable. I wanted simply to make all the culture of our own history available for the campaign. Like I said, if I want to use Shakespeare, I can because he exists in my world... If I want to have a pirate with Napoleanic aspirations, the reference resonates. Maybe at some point I would have gladly wished for an unfettering to our own cultural pool, but I found it more intriguing than not. TimC27
Tue, 28 Nov 95 14:04:32 EST RE: where are the homeworlds? From: delmar watkins <DWATK00@ukcc.uky.edu> To: Star Frontiers Listserv <frontiers@uidaho.edu> OK, I know that this suggestion has been suggested before, but I cool: The vrusk were the first of the interstellar races and expanded to the 'northeast' of the frontier map. They even had a colony that rivalled the homeworld. The other races had their own homeworlds, too. When the races began to expand, they carefully explored and colonized what was then termed, 'the frontier.' These planets are the worlds that we see to-day. BTW: Prenglar system was the designated 'United Nations' world where everyone could come together for diplomatic realtions or trade. Then the Sathar appeared. In one viscious stroke they put the Blue Plague on the homeowrlds, destroying BILIIONS. Scientists in the frontier cured the Blue Plague, but mutations may still exist so no one is allowed on the plague-ridden (and, by the way, radiated from Sathar attacks) planets. These are the plague planets from Zeb's guide. That is why the Sathar are such jerks and that is why the frontier is called such: Even civilization is really a frontier. Like I said, it has already been mentioned, but I thought it would fit in with all the current material and solve the problem of the omeworlds. me, delmar watkins
Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:39:26 -0800 RE: Re: Where did humans come from? From: Mark Damon Hughes <kamikaze@kuoi.asui.uidaho.edu> To: frontiers@crow.csrv.uidaho.edu I've used two strategies to cover this. The first was to declare that SF is set "a long time ago in a galaxy far far away" and that the Humans of the Frontier are unrelated to us - it's just a convenience for the players and GM that they happen to be identical to us. I made Prenglar the Human homeworld, and found other homeworlds for the other races on the SF map. I wanted to keep that first-contact feel (and yes, I was quite aware that it was odd for there to be 5 species with approximately the same tech in the same area - there's only one elder race and then almost every Prenglarform planet had its own sentient species. It took some suspension of disbelief, but I came up with this background when I was just a kid...) The other, used in another campaign, was to dump the SF map and use the old Space Opera Star Sector Atlas books, changing the species to SF races (including the Saurians, but not the cheezy "Rimmers" from Zeb's Guide). This does require some changes - the inhabited stars are farther apart, so you have to make multiple jumps to get between most of them (using waypoint stars - I had listings of the jumps required along the more common trade routes. These made really good ambush points for pirates or Sathar, by the way.) The main virtues of doing this are that it uses actual stars, it's 3D, almost all of the worlds have individual cultures, and it has a much larger background of various empires, wars, and elder species manipulating the younger species. It worked very nicely... -Mark Damon Hughes
Tue, 28 Nov 1995 18:41:55 CDT RE: From: NATHAN FUTRELL <futrena@WKUVX1.WKU.EDU> To: FRONTIERS@uidaho.edu When I started running SF back in the early and mid 80's, Zebulon's Guide had not yet been published, so I wrote my own time line and assigned some of the planets as racial homeworlds. Humans were from a parallel Earth (Terra) which orbited the star Cappella. On the old city map, there was a place called the Cappellan Free Merchants, so I decided that this was a human merchant guild (remember, this is before the Ifsnits became the Cappellan Free Merchants). Cappella was off the bottom right side of the Alpha Dawn star map. I also had another federation that was located within a cluster of the xagyg dust clouds at the bottom of the map known as the Freebooters League, a sort of combination of Larry Niven's Belters and the Pirates of Orion. My timeline included events from the Larry Niven Known Space books, like the Slavers and the Tnuctipun - I was starting to read those books when I first got the game. I also included the Kzinti and the Puppeteers in my game. I eventually introduced the Humma and the Osakar, but never the Ifsnits, and the Mechanons stayed home (the Volturnus modules were part of the campaign). I completely ignored the Zebulon time-line - I already had one I was happy with. I had several other minor races (all stolen - I didn't even bother to file off the serial numbers). Eventually I converted everything, except the ships, to GURPS (the GURPS space combat system really reeks). One of these days I will get around to uploading some of my GURPS conversions and my old campaign data. John
Thu, 30 Nov 95 16:53:40 -0800 RE: Polorria Potpouri From: Andrew L Chang <changa2@watmail.ucr.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Welcome to the world of computerized home shopping! Thank you for subscribing to the bi-annual catalog where you can find all the newest and highest quality equipment available in the Frontier! For the first installment, we have scoured the Frontier for the best prices of the most poplular weapons of defense -- the Blaster. Used by all levels of Law Enforcement and private citizens, laser weaponry is the most diverse in terms use and cost-effectiveness! Included here are the newest on the market, as well as the old favorites. Additionally, as a bonus, we've also included other WP (wave/particle) weapons! So browse and enjoy. **Order information included at the end of the catalog. For bulk discounts, details in back.** This is the first installment of a catalog of weapons that I have developed my own Star Frontiers campaign. It is designed for the old Alpha Dawn rules (my personal favorite), but can be adapted to Zebulon's Guide. Within each type, they are listed in order of popularity. Feel free to print them out and use them. Feedback welcome! The format goes like this. Catagory of Weapon (Beam, Gyrojet, ect.) Type of Weapon (Laser Pistol, Gyrojet Rifle, ect.) Name of Weapon/ Manufacturer Cost: * = Credit Wt: (in kg) Any special notes Ammo Cost: Wt: Beam Weapons Electrostunner Zapper 43-E /Tunix Weaponry Cost:*500 Wt:1 Laser Pistol Magstar /Tunix Weaponry Cost:*600 Wt:1 LE-1500 /Interstellar Weaponry Cost:*750 Wt:2 +1 dmg/die (+2 on setting 2, +4 on 4, ect.) Silver colored; biggest blaster STD Slicer /Armory Cost:*600 Wt:1 Blazer Model 250/Special Defense Inc. Cost:*600 Wt:1 Arrian /Consolidated Nebula Cost:*500 Wt:1 -0.5 dmg/die Laser Rifle STR Cutter /Armory Cost:*800 Wt:3 LE-2000 /Interstellar Weaponry Cost:*900 Wt:4 +1 dmg/die Sunstreak /Tunix Weapory Cost:*850 Wt:3 +5% chance to hit Poly-Tech Sunburst/Special Defense Inc. Cost:*800 Wt:3 Sonic Disruptor Shrieker /Interstellar Weaponry Cost:*700 Wt:4 Siren /Tunix Weaponry Cost:*750 Wt:4.5 +1 dmg/die Sonic Stunner Zapper 48-P /Tunix Weaponry Cost:*500 Wt:1 Heavy Laser Pulsar /Armory Cost:*6 000 Wt:20 LE-5000 /Interstellar Weaponry Cost:*6 500 Wt:22 +1 dmg/die Sunstreak Plus /Tunix Weaponry Cost:*6 500 Wt:20 Range: -/110/550/1.1km/2.2km Heavy Assault SR-48 /Special Defense Inc.Cost:*5 500 Wt:20 Sonic Devastator Arcion /Tunix Weaponry Cost:*4 000 Wt:15 Shrieker II /Zik-kit Ordinance Cost:*4 000 Wt:14 -1 dmg/die
Thu, 30 Nov 1995 19:12:49 CST RE: Re: Polorria Potpouri <9512010053.AA29389@watmail.ucr.edu> From: "rev. roy crisman" <roymeo@iastate.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu For a second, I thought the list had been spammed. Good use of adver-speak! *encourages other to post this sort of thing* roymeo
Fri, 01 Dec 1995 17:56:13 CST RE: more buggy planets <9512010053.AA29389@watmail.ucr.edu> From: "rev. roy crisman" <roymeo@iastate.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu KIZK'-KAR Zik-Kit Moons: None Gravity: 1 Day: 65 hours Year: Diameter: Inclination: 0 Orbit: Atmosphere: Climate Range: Average Surface Temperature: 0 % Water: Trade: Industry, Mining General Notes: Zik-Kit has many rich mineral deposits. The raw ores are exported mainly to Terledrom (Fromeltar) for manufacturing. Home of Zik-kit Ordinance Industries. Terrain/Climate: Life: Native Species: History: Government: The government of Zik-Kit is a democratic syndicracy. Each company indigenous to the planet has a numebr of votes based upon the number of employees that company has employed. Law: (CR 2) Unconcealed weapons are allowed on Zik-Kit. The logic being that everyone (especially law enforcement officers and company guards) knows what they are dealing with this way. This is somewhat strictly enforced as vehic les may have mounted weapons but no concealed weapons, helmet weapons are considered concealed, weapons may be carried in hard to get to places (such as deep in backpacks) but not hidden in a pocket. There are extremely stiff penalties for assaulting company property. Population: Vrusk Heavy. Society/Culture: *' Artificial Satellites: ASS, TS K'TSA-KAR Kawdl-Kit Moons: (3) Skakis, Kubichev-Tik, Colos-Tik Gravity: .7105 Day: 30 hours Year: 347 days Diameter: 13,050 km Inclination: 210 Orbit: Atmosphere: 72% nitrogen, 22% oxygen, 6% other Climate Range: Hot, Humid Average Surface Temperature: 300C % Water: 73% Trade: Mining, Agriculture, (Education) General Notes: Kawdl-Kit is a lush tropical world supporting a myriad of non-sentient life forms and has been charged by the UPF to scan for Sathar in the direction of the White Light Nebulae. It is rich in minerals and is ideal fo r agricultural development. It is also a prime candidate for a large tourism industry. Kawdl-Kit is the object of a political struggle between the on world KUT conglomerate and Streel Corp. The dispute concerns the rightful claim to the territory, and therefore the right to exploit the planet's resources as well as de termining the lifestyle of the people living there. However, a far more pressing problem has occurred recently; the mineral rich planet has been literally shaken by a disaster of global proportions. Terrain/Climate: Kawdl-Kit's upper crust is still highly active, with large occurrences of volcanoes on the continent and several volcanic islands in the ocean ridges. It has small polar ice caps due to the planet's hot and humid climate. Disaster: On FY128.11.18 a stray asteroid travelling at an extraordinary speed passed within 150,000km of the planet's surface. Scientists are still only guessing at the reasons why the asteroid's speed was unusually high, at nearl y 3000km/s (.01c). None of the collected data suggests an artificial cause, but researchers cannot determine why the asteroid was not detected and its course plotted until moments before impact. The asteroid, about 1100m in diameter, colli ded with the planet's smallest and closest moon Skakis (8000km dia.). Both were destroyed on impact, but several large fragments remained. Nine of these shards, each 500-1000m wide, plunged into the atmosphere and onto the planet's surface. The unpredicted results of the asteroid/moon collision gave the citizens of Kawdl-Kit virtually no warning of the impending disaster. Three fragments impacted on the continents, while six others plunged into the oceans. The fragments struck the planet with a force equal to a 200-250 Megaton nuclear explosion each. A huge cloud of dust was thrown into the atmosphere, temporarily blocking out much of the planet's light. The fragments that hit the oceans caused massive shock waves in the water which resulted in waves exceeding 40m in height. Finally, one of the fragments struck an unstable fault line on the continent's southern coast, triggering a devastating earthquake felt across the entire continent. Nearly all of the planet's communities were laid waste, and non escaped unscathed. By the time the last large fragment struck the planet, KUT operations around the Frontier were informed of the disaster and rescue preparations were under way. An accurate account of casualties is still unknown, but the death toll is rising. Many experts estimate that about 45% of Kawdl-Kit's inhabitants were killed or critically injured in the disaster (nearly 630,000 beings). KUT has asked for the help of anyone in the area who may be able to help with disaster relief and rescue operations and the UPF has sent its own rescue teams and offered funds for the payment and outfitting of others. The shifted weather patterns have not been helping; rescue attempts will be difficult in the dim sunlight that pierces the dust clouds. Life: Kawdl-Kit is a lush tropical world that supports myriad non-sentient life forms. The land as well as the seas is full of various flora and fauna. Native Species: Cephalopod History: Kawdl-Kit is a contested world between the Vrusk Kttl'Ul'Tik conglomerate and Streel Corp. The claims to the planet go back to before either company existed. The corporation which later became the Streel mega-corp sent many unmanned probes to star systems near the expanding homeworlds of the Frontier Races. One such probe traveled to the K'tsa-Kar system during 88 pf and determined the planet inhabitable. Later (25 pf), the GVMPI sent a manned (bugged?) expedition to the system and placed a claim beacon in orbit around the planet. When they returned, colonists were immediately sent to the system, as it was determined to be especially suited to Vrusk. Streel Corp saw to gain Kawdl-Kit when it was buying out GVMPI in FY13, and it very well could have been the first mega-corp system. But, GVMPI sold off all of its holdings on the planet during the final hours of autonomy to spare the inhabitants the heavy hand it was witnessing from Streel. The resulting holdings and other companies on the planet grouped together forming the Vrusk conglomerate KUT to further protect itself from further manipulations via Streel. After acquiring GVMPI, Streel sent a task force to the system to attempt to regain it in the usual Streel fashion. KUT took Streel to the UPF and development was halted until a decision was reached. Six months later, the courts ruled in favor of KUT. Naturally, Streel appealed the decision. Construction continued while the court reviewed the Streel case, again the court ruled in favor of KUT. Streel reluctantly agreed to the terms of the ruling, removed its task force, and tensions between the two corporations subsided. Some thirty-five years later(FY125), after Hilo Headow took control at Streel and the rediscovery of logs of the original probe to Kawdl-Kit, Streel is once again focusing upon Kawdl-Kit. Hilo Headow is looking for a focus to strengthen his own power and reunite Streel under his new administration, and Kawdl-Kit is the perfect target. The devastation on Kawdl-Kit was widespread, and the rescue operation would take a great deal of money, people, and equipment. In a "move of friendship," Streel has sent several rescue teams to the K'tsa-Kar system to help with the rescue effort. Streel may have found the opportunity it was looking for. Government: The current government on Kawdl-Kit is a plutocracy: a government run by those with the most wealth. This is done somewhat 'democratically' with each being allowed a vote for every credit claimed on a yearly revenue report. A vote is allocated for solvent credits as well as property and holdings. Voting takes place approximately a month after the yearly reports are due and the validity of the claims are confirmed. Because of this system, the populace is usually very willing to make such reports on time and stiff penalties for fraud such as losing all voting rights keep the reports honest. While corporations do not get voting rights, because of the overwhelming employment of the citizens of Kawdl-Kit by the KUT conglomerate, it is generally seen with favor by the government. Due to the voting methods, public attitude is very important on Kawdl-Kit. Law: (CR 2-3) Weapons upto and including rifles are allowed on Kawdl-Kit due to the low population and diverse life forms on the planet. In civilized areas only laser pistols and non-heavy PGS weapons are generally allowed. Population: Vrusk Light. 1,395,900; roughly 1,000,000 Vrusk, 350,000 Humans, and the rest divided amongst Dralasites who find the world too wet and Yazirians who find it too hot and distant from their homeworlds. Society/Culture: % Zerich Atoll: This is the location of a large (100-150 person) sea bed farm home of the Zerich Commune. More than 2,000km from the planet's main continent, the Zerich Farm was built in the tropics. The members of the Zerich Commune are all humans who left their world(?) to start anew and begin their free-love commune away from many of the pressures of society. The station was constructed on an atoll: the remains of a volcanically formed island which has been worn down by weather over a long period of time. This forms a large shallow area in the sea around a much smaller island. The Zerich atoll can be considered in the last stages of decay, for only a very small strip of land is present above water, ranging from as little as 8m above water at the island, to as deep as 50m or more at the southern tip. The Zerich farm was built at the center of the atoll to gain as much protection as possible, and keep a central location to monitor the agricultural activities. The central tower was built in a level area that is (or rather was), 35 meters under water. The central tower is 70m in diameter, and 50m in height, 15m of which actually did remain above water. From the tower's base, three tunnels extended 300 meters from the center of the station out to smaller monitoring posts, where the robotic maintenance work was controlled. From these, a web of metal posts for supporting the sea-crop extended out in a radius of 750 meters. The sea-drones would monitor food levels and harvest each crop as it ripened. After the disaster, though much of this has changed. Both the earthquake and the wave that hit the station have drastically altered the shape of the atoll. the earthquake caused the ground below the station to collapse, lowering the station 4 meters and tearing a gaping hole in the bottom of the structure itself. The quake weakened the station structurally as well, leaving it in a defenseless position when the wave struck. The station shifted five degrees, and the large communications tower toppled over. About 55% of the station has been flooded, and all survivors are trapped under sea level. ' Skakis: 8000km in diameter, this moon is dust. ' Kubichev-Tik: Second moon. *' Kooistra Station: ASS This satellite is placed in the L5 position of the orbit of Kubichev-Tik. ' Colos-Tik: Third moon.
Fri, 1 Dec 1995 18:20:52 -0600 RE: lasers From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu I noticed while looking at Mark Damon Hughes' page that he had knocked the damage lasers do in Zebulon's Guide down. I've been pondering this as well, and thougth I'd toss this out to the group first. Are lasers too powerful? What do others thing are good damages for them? Considering a KE-2000 (laser rifle) does 16 points per SEU, and can fire all 20 SEU of a clip, I'm willing to say that 320 points of damage is pretty high. Nothing else short of a howitzer has this potential. Put that laser rifle on a backpack, and your Players will be rerolling characters faster than they can look up the pronounciation of skein or albedo in the dictionary. This sort of damage on lasers makes the wearing of albedo screens almost mandatory...nothing else will kill you in one hit even if it does half damage. With the KE-5000 (heavy laser) doing (correction to the book, it's 20, not 100 per seu) 20 points per seu, you have the potential of 400 points of damage. (or the KE-2000 which gets two shots per round, makes that 640 points possible) an albedo screen hooked to a backpack can only absorb 500 points max. When you look at some other games, lasers aren't all that much better than projectiles. Even worse in Traveller. so we have the 'hole passing through the body and cauterizing everything' vs. 'body water instantaneously becomming steam so more damage' arguement to settle, as well. I think maybe part of the problem is that everyone is still thinking somewhat in temrs of projectiles or Star Wars 'beams'. When you pull the trigger on a laser, what will be seen is a thin line of light connecting the target and the gun. None of this beams travelling so you can see the beginning and end of the 'burst' as it flies through the air like in SW. Projectiles make much better assaination weapons, you don't see instantly where the assassin is hiding. I also wonder whether these beams would be more like the laser in Congo, which is a 'constantly on' sort of laser, so you can swing it around and cut up everyone. [The poor gorillas in that movie....on that volcano all they had to eat was Ash! (Ashe?)] I'm rambling now. roymeo
Fri, 1 Dec 1995 19:56:14 -0600 RE: player handouts From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Anyone else make some sort of player handouts to give the players to sort of introduce them to the game easily, or any other sort of handouts: fake newspapers, brief descriptions of motivations, anything besides just maps of where they're at? I'm looking at creating something, as most of my players have never played before and really don't know much about the game/system/races, and I've not been able to convince them to take the rulebooks home with them. roymeo
Fri, 1 Dec 1995 20:31:08 -0600 (CST) RE: Re: lasers From: Christopher Smith <heartlan@mill2.millcomm.com> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu CC: frontiers@uidaho.edu On Fri, 1 Dec 1995 roymeo@iastate.edu wrote: > I noticed while looking at Mark Damon Hughes' page that he had knocked the > damage lasers do in Zebulon's Guide down. I've been pondering this as well, > and thougth I'd toss this out to the group first. > > Are lasers too powerful? > > What do others thing are good damages for them? Hmmm - not powerful enough, I'd say. Let me explain - in my campaigns, I noticed at first a disturbing tendency for the players, especially ones that lacked real roleplaying skills, to try and rambo their way out of situations. Naturally, that can be fun at times, but I like a bit more realism in my games and a bit more character-playing. I actually _increased_ the damage that most weapons do, while adding a nauseating critical injury table that was rolled upon each time a roll resulted in a cobalt hit. Bad guys and law enforcement officers can often be relied upon to carry horribly lethal weapons and be skilled in their use. What all this does is lower the PC's dependence on weapons, while raising the respect they should have for those weapons. If a PC draws their weapon, he/she should realize all the implications that go along with it. Sure, you can go ahead and play the badass shoot-em up cowboy, but on the Frontier you'd also better realize it can get you killed. Sure enough, it wasn't too long before my group undertook some actual problem solving - some social skills, some classic fast talking and a rapid gathering of useful noncombat skills. And when combat does occur, it's very fast and very tense and a big, big deal. Like combat should be. And every once in a while, I'd throw in some malevolent native species that's disgusting but not really deadly, so the PC's could blow off some steam. Later, I'll publish the specs for my Plasma Rifle and Nuke-O-Matic Personal Fusion Weapon. Hee. Chris
Fri, 01 Dec 1995 20:41:44 CST RE: Re: lasers <Pine.3.89.9512012002.A4060-0100000@mill2.MillComm.COM> From: "rev. roy crisman" <roymeo@iastate.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Ah. That was the other part I forgot to mention. In relation to the other weapons, lasers do 'too much' damage. this doesn't mean that lasers need to be downgraded, though. It may mean that everything else needs to be upgraded. so, which way do people go here? (I just figured it would be easier to lower the damages done by 4 weapons, rather than redo all the other weapons...) roymeo http://www.public.iastate.edu/~roymeo/StarFron/sfpage.html
Fri, 1 Dec 1995 20:47:41 -0600 (CST) RE: Re: player handouts From: Christopher Smith <heartlan@mill2.millcomm.com> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu CC: frontiers@uidaho.edu On Fri, 1 Dec 1995 roymeo@iastate.edu wrote: > Anyone else make some sort of player handouts to give the players > to sort of introduce them to the game easily, or any other sort of > handouts: fake newspapers, brief descriptions of motivations, anything > besides just maps of where they're at? > I started a lot of campaigns with a couple of things: 1. A copy of the day's job listings, with a corresponding sheet detailing the truth behind each ad - some of them dangerous, some of them real mundane. I know this doesn't really introduce the world to the characters, but it helps kick-start the game. 2. A copy of the day's big headlines - assassinations, terrorism, natural disasters, surveys, corporate news, politics. These are kind of news blurbs, a lot like USA Today prints on one big page that covers news from all the states. I made them pretty juicy so PC's were interested - if they happened to witness or experience one or two of the events, even better. Enough blurbs will create a pretty good picture of what the Frontier is like in that campaign. If they're interested in any particular item, I'd expand upon it on an impromptu basis. If there's any interest, I could post some of the news items I created. For what it's worth, Chris
Mon, 4 Dec 1995 01:35:52 -0600 RE: changes to my web page From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Due to a suggestion by someone, I found a HTML conversion for MSWord. I now have my entire planet(system) list on my page, thus I don't need to waste listserver bandwidth with occasional postings of various planets. They're all on my page, now. As I make frequent changes to the files I have and will add to my page, the Universe file isn't as pretty as it could be, but it should be generally readible as is. And it should be easy to download and take out all the <BR>'s with a replace, and have it pretty With the permission of TimC27@aol.com, I've also HTML formatted his article about the void posted to AOL. Only changes made were fixing the obvious scaning errors (!=1, etc) and putting a mailto:tim in it. (Tim, if you have a homepage, let me know, and I can put a link in there for you as well) I also put the spaceship skill prereqs that I just posted here in there as well. roymeo
Mon, 4 Dec 1995 09:05:40 -0500 RE: Re: home rules From: TimC27@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu We also ditched the onerous requirements for spacer skills. I made some prerequisites, but otherwise it made no sense for the most masterful mechanic to be the only ones able to even learn how to fire a retro rocket. I really like that photo stunner. How about posting some stats?
Mon, 4 Dec 1995 09:12:46 -0500 RE: Re: changes to my web page From: TimC27@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Much thanks for converting my article. Hope its useful. TimC27@aol.com
Mon, 04 Dec 95 15:20:07 EST RE: From: delmar watkins <DWATK00@ukcc.uky.edu> To: Star Frontiers Listserv <frontiers@uidaho.edu> oops. My last post was intended for roymeo. Sorry it went to 'serv.
Mon, 04 Dec 95 15:16:42 EST RE: Re: changes to my web page From: delmar watkins <DWATK00@ukcc.uky.edu> To: Star Frontiers Listserv <frontiers@uidaho.edu> what is the um...address? to your web page? Inquiring minds want to know! me, delmar watkins
Mon, 04 Dec 1995 15:36:41 CST RE: Re: changes to my web page <951204.151747.EST.DWATK00@ukcc.uky.edu> From: "rev. roy crisman" <roymeo@iastate.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu well, delmar intended this just for me, but it was silly of me to talk about my web page and not send the http address in the post, eh? http://www.public.iastate.edu/~roymeo specifically /StarFron/sfpage.html roymeo
Tue, 5 Dec 1995 11:18:56 -0500 RE: The Big Bang From: JohnAslan@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu to TimC27: Sorry this took longer that I thought. In response to your Big Bang questionxthe one thing I've learned is that space-time, or the universe itself, was expanding from the moment of the big bang. In fact one example I found suggested gluing pennies to a balloon, and then inflating said balloon to simulate the expanding universe - now to me the pennies get further apart because the space between them gets bigger, not because the pennies have any velocity. Ugh. Cosmology gives me a headache. If your really interested in this, I suggest the 'The Origin Of The Universe' title, from 'The Science Masters Series', published by BasicBooks. About your thrust question: You nailed me. Why would thrust, based on Newton's Third Law of action=reaction, which is firmly grounded in normal space-time's physics, even work in the Void? Never mind what happens to the thrust particles. Yeech. Actually the thrust from the ship is travelling in the opposite direction, so accounting for inertia, I'd say that the thrust particles are travelling at 12 Mkm/sec minus 1G of accelleration, and therefore never accompanies the starship into the void. To my knowledge, the time spent in the Void is spent coasting. No thrust, except for the braking rockets, is generated while in the Void. And I personally believe that it is the application of energy, not the thrust from the braking rockets, that breaks the magic spell and returns the starship to the space-time we call home. But that's just my current thinking. A missile fired just before reaching the Void threshold speed would zip into the Void and be lost, unless you fired it to the rear of the launching ship. Or sideways. Then it wouldn't hit the critical speed, and would function normally. Hope that this is helpful. P.S.: Please don't misunderstand my enthusiasm in advocating the Void for a 'I'm right, and you're totally wrong' attitude. I'm simply trying to share my solutions for this important problem. I enjoy hearing the ideas and solutions of others to the same problems. Or other problems. I also happen to like trying to work within the information presented. But others should do whatever they like best. Clearly, most of you liked the idea of a Void drive. It certainly tidys up the problems and questions that I spent months thinking through. If a drive system works for you, think of all that extra time you had to plan and play the game.
Tue, 5 Dec 1995 14:53:34 -0800 RE: Re: The Big Bang From: Mark Damon Hughes <kamikaze@kuoi.asui.uidaho.edu> To: frontiers@crow.csrv.uidaho.edu JohnAslan@aol.com spake: >P.S.: Please don't misunderstand my enthusiasm in advocating the Void for a >'I'm right, and you're totally wrong' attitude. I'm simply trying to share >my solutions for this important problem. I enjoy hearing the ideas and >solutions of others to the same problems. Or other problems. I also happen >to like trying to work within the information presented. Unfortunately, the information provided is nonsensical. When that happens, you have to assume that the writers were just tired and babbled some ideas onto paper without thinking about them. (What, you mean TSR might have skimped on the reality-checking in a game? Say t'ain't so!) The image of a Void and needing some specific velocity to be able to enter it are as reasonable as any other FTL drive, but very little else about it makes any sense. Automatically going into the Void when you hit 3333km/s, and not coming out until you reverse thrust, not only violates conservation of matter/ energy, but it's provably false: in the real universe, many objects move substantially faster than .01C, and we don't seem to be losing matter that way... By the Void mechanics as written, entire galaxies should be blinking out of existence, dooming whatever intelligent species are in them to float forever through the Void... Also note that by the mechanics of the Second Sathar War game, you have to accelerate 12 hours for each light year you travel (and decelerate the same amount the other half of the way), and 1 ADF is 3G... 12 hours at 3G gives us 1,270km/s acceleration... Which means that it really takes at least 32 hours to hit jump speed. (Ignoring for the moment that 1 ADF = 3G makes for really unhappy fighter pilots and incredibly efficient drives). Trying to make any kind of sense of their math or physics is just going to convince you the writers were all 3rd-grade dropouts. -Mark Damon Hughes
Tue, 5 Dec 1995 19:16:03 -0500 RE: Re: No Subject From: IndyCCTX@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu In a message dated 95-12-04 00:26:18 EST, you write: >If, as the un-corrected rules say >, a heavy laser does 100Ps, then we're talking out of control game >balance. Very early on, we changed the max damage of the Ke5000 to 40pSEU; the rationalle behind that number was that it was a bit better than a Ke2000 rifle in dealing damage in the same time frame (given that the rifle has a ROF of 2, and the Ke5000 a ROF of 1). It's a heck of a lot more efficient powerwise, if you're in a situation where you can't just run out to a weapon shop and buy more SEU... but otherwise wasn't a game-killer. Or no more than the laser rifle was. Never go on an adventure without a hat! Indy IndyCCTX@aol.com (The Junkman)
Tue, 05 Dec 1995 18:48:16 CDT RE: Photostunners From: NATHAN FUTRELL <futrena@WKUVX1.WKU.EDU> To: FRONTIERS@uidaho.edu PhotoStunner (also called a Laser Diffuser) Damage = Save vs. Stamina or be stunned (as per other stunners) Range = 1/2 that of a normal laser weapon Power Usage = 2 SEUs per shot Cost = 400 Cr + Cost of the Weapon it is installed on. A Photostunner with no damage setting costs the same as a normal laser. A Heavy Laser otostunner has the same stats as above except that it uses 10 SEU/shot and attacks as an Autofire Burst (AD p. 23, except 5 meter wide area and no maximum on number of targets in the area). It costs 1000 Cr + the cost of the weapon. Heavy Laser Pistol Damage = 1d10-20d10 Range = 10/30/80/160/300 (meters) Power Usage = 1 SEU/1d10 damage Rate of Fire = 2 (1 if power setting changed) Cost = 1200 Cr A very large handgun and difficult to conceal. +20 to Intuition checks for the gun to be noticed. Electroblaster Damage = 6d10 Range = As Electrostunner Power Usage = 4 SEU/shot Rate of Fire = 1 Cost = 600 CR An overloaded Electrostunner with no stun setting. BTW, the Photostunner has a Rate of Fire of 1 John
Tue, 05 Dec 1995 19:26:24 CDT RE: More Weapons From: NATHAN FUTRELL <futrena@WKUVX1.WKU.EDU> To: FRONTIERS@uidaho.edu Shotgun Damage = Small Shot - 2d10 (1d10 to adjacent targets, if any) Buck Shot - 3d10 Flechette - 3d10 (1d10 to adjacent targets, if any) Slug - 4d10 Note that both shot types and flechette are +10 to hit. Range = 5/15/30/60/100 Ammo = 6 rds (internal magazine) Rate of Fire = 2 Cost = 250 Cr (5 Cr/6 rds of ammo, 10 Cr/6rds of Flechette) Yes, there are double barrel shotguns and shotguns that hold more than 6 shots, but this was an average shotgun. Military Shotgun Damage = Small Shot (Burst) - 6d10 +1d10/additional target Buck Shot (Burst) - 7d10 +1d10/additional target Flechette (Burst) - 7d10 +1d10/additional target Slug (Burst) - 8d10 +1d10/additional target See above for single shot damages for the different types of shells. When autofired, the shotgun receives only the Burst modifier (+20). Range = As normal shotgun Ammo = 20 rd drum Rate of Fire = 2 (single shot) or 5 (burst - may only hit up to 4 adjacent targets, as per burst fire rules) Cost = 750 Cr (20 Cr/20rd drum, 40 Cr/20rd drum of Flechette ammo) Shotguns may optionally do only 1/2 damage against a skeinsuit Point Blank range when firing shot (1/4 damage to the suit and 1/4 damage to the wearer) to reflect the fact that the damage is already spread out. Flamer/Incinerator Damage = 3d10 (+1d10/turn if wearing flammable clothing) Albedo Suits will absorb 1/2 damage (reflecting the heat) and will not burn. This counts against the Albedo suit's total points. Range = 10/20/30/40/50 Ammo = 10 charges (tank mounted on the flamer); 20 charges (backpack tank) Rate of Fire = 1 Cost = 250 Cr (10 Cr for 10 shot tank, 50 Cr for 20 shot backpack) Neither fuel tank will explode if hit - it has a safety liner to prevent this. It will burn... Survival Rifle Damage = 1d10/shot Range = 10/30/75/150/300 Ammo = 20 shots (uses an Auto Pistol Magazine) Rate of Fire = 3 Cost = 300 CR (2 Cr for Bulletclip) The Survival rifle breaks down into the stock, action, and barrel. The action and barrel can be stored in the stock when the weapon is not needed. The weapon will also float, whether it is assembled or disassembled. I stole the idea from the .22 LR AR-7 rifle. TASER (advanced) Damage = Save vs. Stamina at -25 or be stunned (as electrostunner) If you have an anti-shock implant, you still must save at Stamina+10 or be stunned (for half as long as normal) Range = 1/2/3/4/5 Power Usage = 5 SEUs/shot Rate of Fire = 1/2 (it takes a couple of seconds for the cables to retract and the capacitor to recharge) Cost = 600 Cr (100 Cr for 20 SEU power pack) The TASER may also act as a stun stick on contact (same effects and power usage). The TASER may use any power pack. Pen Laser Damage = 1-10d10 Range = 3/6/9/12/15 (hard to aim) Power Uasge = 1 SEU/shot Rate of Fire = 2 (1 if power setting is changed) Cost = 800 Cr The Laser Pen has a 10 SEU internal battery which must be recharged when expended. Many jurisdictions outlaw the laser pen. It may also be used as a laser soldering or welding device (soldering uses 1 SEU/10 turns, welding uses 2 SEU/turn) Enjoy. John.
Tue, 5 Dec 1995 20:51:39 -0500 RE: Re: The Big Bang From: TimC27@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu To John Aslan: Thanks a lot for the research! Boy, Yah see what kinda answers you get when you ask questions. I am still fuzzy on that Balloon and Pennies thing. I would like to try it out, but in the interest of making this everyone's experiment, maybe you could all send those pennies to me, and I will engage in the actual experiment. Of course, pennies aren't really like stars, are they. Nope totally wrong color. Let's see.... What about... Of course. Quarters... Nah. they don't have the mass of say, silver dollars. But the heck with that stuff. Really, I think something closer in mass to a lighter element,... how about Carbon. Yeah. A carbon/hydrogen compound, like paper. Yeah. some paper money would probably be better. How bout it everyone. You get the easy part. Just send me some paper money and heck, I'll supply the balloon and the very breath of life. We'll get this void thing worked right out. Tim "future physicists of America" Manana
Wed, 6 Dec 1995 20:33:06 -0700 (MST) RE: Re: The Big Bang From: Markus Wilkinson <mark@gas.physics.usu.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu > I am still fuzzy on that Balloon and Pennies thing. I would like to try it > out, but in the interest of making this everyone's experiment, maybe you > could all send those pennies to me, and I will engage in the actual > experiment. Of course, pennies aren't really like stars, are they. Nope > totally wrong color. Let's see.... What about... Of course. Quarters... Actually, I think lit firecrackers would best simulate it. I'll light, you blow! :) Actually it is not the stars that do this, it is galaxies. As the universe expands, galaxies become separated by greater distance. Stars pretty much just float around in the galaxy, orbiting an enormous black hole or the sum of their masses. -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Markus Wilkinson Net: mark@gas.physics.usu.edu Mail: Hughes Space and Communications, EO/E1/D112 2000 E. El Segundo Blvd, El Segundo, CA 90245, USA Phone: 310/416-4647 (work), 310/379-6165 (home) Radio: KC7IHX
Sat, 9 Dec 1995 16:37:08 -0500 RE: More on the Void From: JohnAslan@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu To TimC27: I'll be happy to sent you all my Monopoly money. I'm sorry to have harassed you, when you asked for other opinions concerning the Void I took you seriously... I have read your Void article, thanks to roymeo's sfpage, and I liked it. You filled in the gaps and developed some interesting ideas. In particular the Void Transit Syndrome; the different effects for different races is very good. I explored a similar theme in a psionics article I wrote. I'm curious as to why you kept the 0.1%C crossover speed, though. To prevent anyone but a truely desperate crew from 'jumping' out of every dangerous situation the calculation time alone would have done the job (ala Star Wars), wouldn't it? To Mark Damon Hughes: You wrote: >you have to accelerate 12 hours for each light year you travel (and decelerate the >same amount the other half of the way), and 1 ADF is 3G... I've been unable to find these figures in the game, of course I haven't had time ro do more than glance over them. Could you tell me where this information is? Thanks. In addition, you wrote: >...in the real universe, many objects move substantially faster than .01C... In my earlier posts to Tim, my research turned up the fact that natural objects in space don't move that fast; even matter ejected by a nova or supernova doesn't reach the neccessary speeds. And as I stated in my "The Big Bang" post, the movement of the galaxies in relation to one another seems to have less to do with velocity than it does with the continued expansion of space-time, that is, the universe itself. The only exception to this seems to be light, which I thought could be exempted because of its dual nature, existing as both particle and wave simultaneously. If you know of or discover something to the contrary, please let me know. Thanks again. -J
Sat, 9 Dec 1995 20:08:19 -0600 RE: void sillyness From: roymeo@iastate.edu To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Remember to take plenty of replacement circulatory fluid in all your ships when you are going to be jumping the void. When you've got the ship almost to the required speed (for those using the .01c constant speed only) the blood pumping through your body is sure to be going just a touch faster in some areas and thus jumping into the void without you. When the ship pushes over into the void velocity, some areas will have blood going 'backwards' and thus won't enter the void at all. Also make sure all passengers realise they cannot move once you get very close. No use having passengers trying to sit forward and pushing their heads into the void too soon. Maybe have to require a cleaning deposit for all passengers. This would be a good way to get rid of any other PC's you don't like. Just give them a shove...all you have to loose is your arms. "What is it that happened to old Mad Jack, anyway?" "He used to roll his eyes at Konchinho's game-show announcer type announcements. Well, one day Kon made an especially bad announcement that we were going into the void in 3 seconds...." "and?" "He rolled his eyes!" I wonder if vampires hide out in the void. Would make sense, all that extra blood... roymeo
Sat, 9 Dec 1995 22:35:46 -0800 RE: Re: More on the Void From: Mark Damon Hughes <kamikaze@kuoi.asui.uidaho.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu JohnAslan@aol.com spake: >You wrote: >>you have to accelerate 12 hours for each light year you travel (and >decelerate the >same amount the other half of the way), and 1 ADF is 3G... >I've been unable to find these figures in the game, of course I haven't had >time ro do more than glance over them. Could you tell me where this >information is? Thanks. The Second Sathar War boardgame in the "Warriors of White Light" module from the Knight Hawks boxed set gives the "one day of acceleration per light year" info. Doing the math from Knight Hawks itself gave me the 1 ADF = 3G figure (10000 km/600 s^2) / (9.8m/s^2) = 2.8 G (I'd actually forgotten that I'd rounded that off before). >In addition, you wrote: >>...in the real universe, many objects move substantially faster than .01C... > >In my earlier posts to Tim, my research turned up the fact that natural >objects in space don't move that fast; Matter falling towards black holes, for one. According to Hawking, IIRC, there are plenty of other relativistic objects. >And as I stated in my "The >Big Bang" post, the movement of the galaxies in relation to one another seems >to have less to do with velocity than it does with the continued expansion of >space-time, that is, the universe itself. Doesn't matter what causes it, it's still velocity. Relative to us, many galaxies are moving at high fractions of C. And those velocities are just as valid as any other... --- Roymeo missed the most obvious example, though - hearts. There you are, one moment, with your heart pumping along merrily, and then WHAM! Your heart jumps just a moment before you do, and then it pumps the other way and drops back out of the void... -Mark Damon Hughes
Sun, 10 Dec 1995 14:57:24 -0500 RE: Re: More on the Void From: Rroorr@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Page 33 of the Knight Hawks rules gives the following figure, "On a normal interstellar voyage, the starship pulls away from the space station and begins accelerating at 1G toward it's destination star. This is about the same acceleration a ship uses when it increases it's speed on the boardgame map by one hex per turn." Using these statistics, 1 g of acceleration equals an ADF of 1. Thus if a ship like an Assault Scout accelerates at and ADF of 5, the passenger's are subjected to about 5 g's of force, not to mention the G forces of whatever turns that ship is making during the combat round. The strange part of it is, under the rules for the various drives, the rules state that a ship with chemical drives or Ion drives always has an ADF of one. I have modified those stats for my game so that a chemical drive can pull significantly higher G's of acceleration for short periods of time, like to accelerate from the atmosphere of a planet. Otherwise, a shuttle couldn't even reach orbital velocity on a normal planet, as it's engines would have only enough thrust to hover in place on a planet with one G of gravity and be unable to even take off from a planet with higher than one G. Those stats are fine for Ion drives though, as a freighter in Star Frontiers only docks at orbital stations to unload it's cargo, and thus, doesn't have to worry about landings and take-offs. Plus it gives a good reason why ships with Ion drives can't land on planets.
Mon, 11 Dec 1995 09:59:20 -0500 RE: Re: Where I found my information. From: TimC27@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Whew, thanks to all who had their manuals handy... I hate it when someone asks me for something as pesky as "facts". Sheesh. I had to tell you, I Was Rolling over the that stuff about blood pumping. Made my mind reel with the possibilities. Imagine a really cool fight at the 'void horizon'. I throw a punch, but my had disappears into the void! I could shoot a bunch of bullets out of the void and give someone a negative thrust backwards as the ship disappears around them. Cool. 'Course, my little Void Transit Field, and all those other devices you have come up with would solve the problems, but boy its giving me a pain in my side laughing about the ludicrosities I had never previously imagined >:) Tim
Mon, 11 Dec 95 10:46:28 EST RE: From: delmar watkins <DWATK00@ukcc.uky.edu> To: Star Frontiers Listserv <frontiers@uidaho.edu> Has anyone on the list allowed characters from races that the PCs may have found? For instance, the group of players I am currently playing with has almost finished the Volturnus series. While making an advantage disadvantage system for star frontiers (made with Top Secret+Hero+Over the Edge+Star Frontiers' material) I made the disadvantage 'can't use tech', hoping that someone would eventually play a character, like an Ul-mor, Kurabunda, or Edestekai. Another advantage was 'psionically touched,' which I could see the Eorna fitting. It seems to me that if one is to introduce psionics, the Eorna would be a good way to do it. Or what about the Mhemne? 'Gravitational/Inertial Sickness'. It seems to me that the Eorna and Mhemne would fit perfectly in Frontier society; A picture in one of the modules even shows a bar with a bunch of Mhemne, humans, vrusk, yazirians, and dralasites. Eorna would give a boost to frontier tech because they seem to be just as advanced, but in different ways. SO WHY DIDN'T TSR PUT THEM IN ZEBULON'S GUIDE!!!!!! me, delmar watkins
Mon, 11 Dec 95 06:08:47 EST RE: Re: More on the Void From: "Eric Pawtowski" <epawtows@vt.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu In Message Sun, 10 Dec 1995 14:57:24 -0500, Rroorr@aol.com writes: >ADF of one. I have modified those stats for my game so that a chemical >drive can pull significantly higher G's of acceleration for short periods of >time, like to accelerate from the atmosphere of a planet. Otherwise, a Hmmm. Our team was once on an ion-drive converted assault scout that *also* had a set of chemical engines, so that it could take off and land. Not enough rocket fuel to do much deep-space maneuvering. We also modfied hyperspace travel- there is a seperate set of engines, (the "jump engines") that are required to get into hyperspace. Jump engines don't provide thrust, they're just this box that sits in the engine compartment that does strange stuff when you turn it on. Eric >shuttle couldn't even reach orbital velocity on a normal planet, as it's >engines would have only enough thrust to hover in place on a planet with one >G of gravity and be unable to even take off from a planet with higher than >one G. Those stats are fine for Ion drives though, as a freighter in Star >Frontiers only docks at orbital stations to unload it's cargo, and thus, >doesn't have to worry about landings and take-offs. Plus it gives a good >reason why ships with Ion drives can't land on planets. -- epawtows@vt.edu--------------------------------------------------- Technicon 13- SF&F return to the New River Valley in SW VA! March 22-24, 1996! L.E. Modesitt, Lori&Corey Cole, Ruth Thompson
Mon, 11 Dec 1995 12:52:59 -0700 (MST) RE: Re: More on the Void From: Markus Wilkinson <mark@gas.physics.usu.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu > info. Doing the math from Knight Hawks itself gave me the 1 ADF = 3G figure > (10000 km/600 s^2) / (9.8m/s^2) = 2.8 G (I'd actually forgotten that I'd > rounded that off before). Wait a second. Given one hex in Knight Hawks was 10,000 km and one turn was 10 minutes. Therefore, acceleration = 10E6m/(600s)^2, not 10E6m/600 s^2, but I guess that is a typo because the math comes out right. Just as a side note, given x = x0 + vt + 0.5at^2 (which is non-relavistic and plenty good for 0.1 C speeds), and simplifying v = at, where a = 27.7 m/s^2 and t = 20 hours (a SF std day). You get 2E6 m/s. This divided by c (300E6 m/s), gives 6.66E-3, which is 0.006. Therefore, after accelerating at an ADF of one for a standard day, a vessel is travelling at 6/10ths of one percent of c. How close is that to the rules again? Just from a physiology standpoint, I've done 4.5 gs for about 5 seconds (no g pants) and it is very uncomfortable. I could not imagine the human body sustaining 3 gs in any position but lying for more than 5 minutes. Concluding, T$R hires writers, not scientists. You should play _Universe_ instead of SF. Mark -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Markus Wilkinson Net: mark@gas.physics.usu.edu Mail: Hughes Space and Communications, EO/E1/D112 2000 E. El Segundo Blvd, El Segundo, CA 90245, USA Phone: 310/416-4647 (work), 310/379-6165 (home) Radio: KC7IHX
Mon, 11 Dec 1995 18:08:00 CDT RE: From: NATHAN FUTRELL <futrena@WKUVX1.WKU.EDU> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu I had stats for the Ul-Mor and the Eorna (everybody in the game hated the Edestakai (sp?) and thought the Kurabanda were too much like Yazirians), but nobody ever played them. The characters all really liked the Ul-Mor - the ones who had played in the Great Game went back every couple of years to participate again. In my campaign, the characters were the ones who contacted the Humma and the Osakar (who were fighting over a planet that they both wanted to colonize) and helped bring them into the Federation. John. -- --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Nathan Futrell | "That which does not kill us must have missed us." The Madd Katt | ---Friedrich Nietzsche futrena@WKUVX1.BITNET | | "Is it me, or does Rush Limbaugh look like Jabba | the Hut?" ---The Madd Katt (Bo shuda.) ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sat, 16 Dec 1995 14:56:25 PST RE: SF stuff FS From: Wes Shull <shul9478@uidaho.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Will sell these outright, or trade for PSX games or D&D rules hardback (NOT AD&D). [Yes, I'm evil. I like original D&D...] List of PSX games I'm interested in at end of post. Pick & choose ok, but priority given to those who want everything. Also, priority given to those with the best offer, and in the case of same offer, whoever offered first. I already have an offer on one of the KH modules, but I'd prefer to sell the whole bunch at once. I'm talking along the lines of $20 + shipping takes it all, so don't be too reluctant to make an offer... All Star Frontiers stuff in usable (not pristine) condition: qty what --- ---- 2 AD Basic rules 3 AD Expanded rules 2 AD box 2 KH campaign book 1 ref's screen (no mini-module) 1 KH UPF tac ops manual 2 AD port loren maps 2 AD ship/terrain maps X AD counters (more or less one full set) 2 SF0 2 SF1 2 SF2 1 SFAD5 1 SFAD6 1 KH0 (warriors of white light) 1 SFKH1 1 SFKH2 1 SFKH3 1 SFKH4 In trade, I'm interested in anything for the PSX except: Toshinden SF:TM MK3 Kileak Twisted Metal Japanese versions of games that aren't too language-involved are ok. In other words, no Japanese RPGs, but anything else should be ok in Japanese. No Chinese. I'll consider bootlegs, but I probably won't give them as much trade value as originals. I'm interested in multiple copies of any games that can be played head-head with a link cable, with the exception of Ridge Racer (have one copy already, so only need one more). Make offers to me; shul9478@uidaho.edu. Will be netless for a month or so starting the 24th, so that's the cutoff. Thanks! -- Wes Shull - shul9478@uidaho.edu - http://www.cs.uidaho.edu/~shul9478 "It is entirely the fault of the almost mind-numbing incompetence of a certain local exchange telephone carrier. Who shall remain anonymous, but has large white trucks with a blue logo and three letters. Their initials are "GTE" but that's all I can say." - Chris Magagna, UI network guy, on why our T1 went down
Sun, 17 Dec 95 16:21:29 EST RE: counters From: delmar watkins <DWATK00@ukcc.uky.edu> To: Star Frontiers Listserv <frontiers@uidaho.edu> Just wondering how everyone else thinks about this issue: Why do people in the frontier explore? From the sound of it, the planets that are inhabited are still not full and have plenty of resources. It also seems to me that anyone with an education, and education is cheap and easily accessible, can get a great paying job. So, if the frontier economy is booming, why expand so quickly? Voodoo economics? Human/Vruskan/Yazirian racism? Need for raw materials or markets? Or is it some other factor? me, delmar watkins
Sun, 17 Dec 1995 17:39:28 -0700 (MST) RE: Re: counters From: Markus Wilkinson <mark@gas.physics.usu.edu> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu CC: mark@gas.physics.usu.edu (Markus Wilkinson), mike@gas.physics.usu.edu (Michael Wilkinson) > So, if the frontier economy is booming, why expand so quickly? > > Voodoo economics? Human/Vruskan/Yazirian racism? Need for > raw materials or markets? Or is it some other factor? > > me, > delmar watkins Here are some reasons: Coorporations set operations on a remote planet to escape government regulation. Religious groups establish their own theocracy on a remote world to escape religious persecution. People migrate to undeveloped worlds to establish a cultural identity. Manifest destiny (the psycological need to expand). If you had the opportunity to colonize a planet orbiting one of the Alpha Centauri suns, whould you do it? What factors would make you want to; which would not? In short, people are difficult to understand. Mass colonizationn, if available, would occur for reasons specific to individuals, not coutries, economies, or whatever. -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Markus Wilkinson Net: mark@gas.physics.usu.edu Mail: Hughes Space and Communications, EO/E1/D112 2000 E. El Segundo Blvd, El Segundo, CA 90245, USA Phone: 310/416-4647 (work), 310/379-6165 (home) Radio: KC7IHX
Mon, 18 Dec 1995 13:07:39 -0500 RE: Why Explore? From: TimC27@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu While the good jobs and education seem plentiful and affordable, respectively, exploration is also cheap and easy, relatively speaking. Also there are creepy enemy types out there who migh yuk up the good planets. Tim
Mon, 18 Dec 1995 14:01:05 -0600 (CST) RE: Re: counters From: Christopher Smith <heartlan@mill2.millcomm.com> To: frontiers@uidaho.edu CC: Star Frontiers Listserv <frontiers@uidaho.edu> On Sun, 17 Dec 1995, delmar watkins wrote: > Just wondering how everyone else thinks about this issue: > > So, if the frontier economy is booming, why expand so quickly? One big reason is the Sathar. Many times, upon landing on an "unexplored" planet, my characters would find Sathar already there, recently left, or somewhere nearby. I think the fear exists that the expansionist Sathar will have the Frontier surrounded if allowed to spread unchallenged. That, plus you can get rich and famous if you find something cool. Chris
Tue, 19 Dec 95 11:13:20+120 RE: Re: counters From: gorham@krems.kmr.ll.mit.edu (Tim Whisenhunt) To: frontiers@uidaho.edu >Just wondering how everyone else thinks about this issue: > >Why do people in the frontier explore? From the sound of it, >the planets that are inhabited are still not full and have plenty >of resources. It also seems to me that anyone with an education, >and education is cheap and easily accessible, can get a great paying >job. > >So, if the frontier economy is booming, why expand so quickly? > >Voodoo economics? Human/Vruskan/Yazirian racism? Need for >raw materials or markets? Or is it some other factor? > >me, >delmar watkins > I would say it was for one or all of four reasons: 1. Perhaps Manifest destiny, expand because it is there, and to find a place of "your own" like a galactic land grab. 2. Greed, money seeking to make more money, also a good place to post unwanted executives. 3. The Sathar, more information on them, and more allies against them. 4. Exploration exemplifies a vibrant advancing society, while complacency and xenophobia eventually leads to some form of stagnation and/or moral decay. Of course, it could have been put in there for the unlimited plots it could spawn, who's to say. Tim W. "Yazirians, Wookies with wings? You decide" -Pallor Alton, comedian, Deceased (tragic incident involving a Yazirian bar and a piano)
Tue, 19 Dec 1995 13:27:31 -0500 RE: Falconet grenade launcher From: IndyCCTX@aol.com To: frontiers@uidaho.edu Here's a couple of weapons I invented and have been using (well, I'm using the model 2 now, instead of the original). Stats are for Zebulon's Guide, obviously. (Though conversion back to AD rules is possible, of course; use the grenade damages as given in those rules, range is the same as a grenade rifle.) Prices aren't given as these are one of a kind items in the game I'm playing; but the cost to build the Falconet is about 1000cr, not including labor costs (somewhat less for an actual production model); the Mk II will run 3 to 5 times as much due to the much more advanced and lighter weight materials used. (If you use the lower multiplier, increase the mass of the weapon). Name Range max dam Ammo SEU ROF Ef def Mass Falconet D grenade 6 - 3 V 5 Falconet Mk II D grenade 6x2+1 sp 3 V 5 The Falconet Mk II has two side by side clips, and can accept single rounds as well. A switch determines which feed is used; when a clip is empty, it automatically switches to the other clip. The weapon feed is powered by a powerclip for 200 rounds, a minipowerclip for 100 rounds, or an SEU microdisc (usually used as a backup) for 20 rounds. A digital display gives information on which feed is being used, how many rounds are in each clip, what type of rounds are ready to be chambered, and how much power is available. A specially modifed scope can show this information as well. The rifle is in a bullpup configuration. Maxi Falconet clip Holds 15 grenade rounds. Powered by an SEU microdisc good for 45 rounds (3 full clips). May be used in either model of the Falconet. Flechette round Defense: Inertia Material cost: 5 Cr (plus labor, if applicable) This round is two range categories worse (B in the Falconet). The area of effect is a cone, 1 m wide at short range, from 2-5 m at medium and 6-10 m at long range. Damage done depends on range and size of target. Range Max damage Column shift Point blank (0-10 m) 60 +0 CS Short 48 +1 CS Medium 24 +2 CS Long 12 +3 CS Use the target size modifer on this chart: a huge creature (+2 CS) at long range takes 48 max, a tiny creature (-1 CS) at point blank takes 48 max. A tiny creature at long range will only take 8 max, and each shift above point blank adds 4 points. Note that one creature directly behind another will be shielded. If of the same size, halve max damage; if the front creature is larger, the shielded creature will not be damaged. A larger creature behind a small one takes damage normally. Any creature larger than man size at point blank range will prevent any damage from getting past. If this round is not used in a modified (reinforced) grenade rifle, it is likely to damage the rifle or even blow it apart (odds increase if done more than once). Each round fired is a cumulative 20% chance; adjust by +10% for an old, heavily used grenade rifle, -5% for a new one. Max damage is 24pts to the shooter, rolled on +X; all others within 1m who fail a RS check roll on col +1.
Last modified: 96Feb13 20:14